In this episode, Professor Sally Gainsbury speaks with Dr Timothy Fong, Clinical Professor of Psychiatry at UCLA, Co-Director of the UCLA Gambling Studies Program (UGSP), and lead investigator on the Financial Stability and Responsible Gambling Initiative. Together, they explore why financial harm from gambling is often recognised only after it has become severe, despite financial changes frequently emerging much earlier. They discuss the close relationship between financial and mental health, how digital payments and easy access to credit have changed the gambling environment, and why simply asking someone how much debt they have may fail to capture the true financial impact of their gambling.

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Show notes and related links:

Check out the UCLA Gambling Program: https://uclagamblingprogram.org/

Financial Stability and Responsible Gambling Initiative (FSRG): https://fsrginitiative.org/

Kindbridge Research Institute: https://kindbridgeinstitute.org/

Gamfin Financial Counseling for Gambling Addiction: https://www.gamfin.org/

Etcera Foundation: https://ecstra.org.au/

Want to learn more about financial literacy? – Listen to Episode 1 with Prof. Annamaria Lusardi and Episode 2 with Dr. Tracey West

What makes a digital tool worthy of trust? Professor Sally Gainsbury speaks with Maureen Abbott, Director of Innovation at the Mental Health Commission of Canada, about the governance of digital mental health tools and what other digital environments can learn from it. They explore app assessment frameworks, AI and the tension between innovation and precaution, and the role of equity and inclusion in designing safe and accessible digital tools. The conversation also considers how these principles could apply beyond mental health, including gambling, financial platforms and AI-powered financial literacy tools. The episode asks whether effective digital interventions can succeed without first earning the trust of the people they are designed to support.

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Show notes:

Mental Health Commission of Canada – App Assessment Framework:

https://mentalhealthcommission.ca/app-assessment/

E-Mental Health Strategy for Canada:

https://mentalhealthcommission.ca/resource/ementalhealthstrategy/

National Guidance for AI in Mental Health and Substance Use Health Care:

https://mentalhealthcommission.ca/ai-in-mental-health/

WHO – Ethics and Governance of Artificial Intelligence for Health:

https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/9789240029200

eMHPrac – Digital Mental Health Resource Directory:

https://www.emhprac.org.au/directory/

Mental Health Commission of Canada:

https://mentalhealthcommission.ca/

Stephen M. R. Covey – The Speed of Trust

Description:

In this episode, Professor Sally Gainsbury speaks with Carly Grace Allen about how interaction design and user experience (UX) principles can improve responsible gambling tools. Drawing on large-scale field experiments conducted within Norsk Tipping, Carly discusses how message framing, risk communication, mandatory limit setting, and behavioural design influence real gambling behaviour. The conversation explores how evidence-based UX design can support informed decision-making and preventative gambling interventions at population scale.

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Show notes and links

Connect with Carly Grace Allen via LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/carlygraceallen/?locale=no

Learn more about Carly’s research:
Allen, C. G., Sveen, T., Volden, F. S., & Inal, Y. (2025). Framing the Risk: A Large-Scale Field Experiment on Risk Communication in Responsible Gambling. INTERACT 2025. https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-032-05002-1_16

Explore upcoming conferences where Carly will be presenting her research:
- European Association for the Study of Gambling (EASG) Conference (https://www.easg.org/conferences)
- European Lotteries (EL/WLA) Responsible Gaming & Sustainability Seminar (https://www.european-lotteries.org/events)
- National Center for Responsible Gaming (NCRG) Conference on Gambling and Addiction (https://www.americangaming.org/event/ncrg-conference-on-gambling-and-addiction/)

Books mentioned:
- Harry Brignull – Dark Patterns
- Stephen Wendel – Designing for Behavior Change

In this episode, Dr Mandeep Singh joins Professor Sally Gainsbury to explore what really drives betting behaviour from one moment to the next. Drawing on transaction-level data from more than 24,000 Australian online sports bettors, they discuss how wins and losses shape subsequent betting decisions, why access to money (liquidity) matters, and whether current safer gambling tools are helping people regulate their behaviour in the ways they intend.

Dr Mandeep Singh is a Lecturer in Finance at the University of Sydney Business School. His research spans empirical asset pricing, financial intermediation and climate finance. In this conversation, he discusses interdisciplinary research combining finance, psychology and behavioural science to better understand gambling behaviour and how digital environments influence financial decision-making.

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Show notes and links

Read the paper here: http://dx.doi.org/10.2139/ssrn.6305500

University of Sydney Business School: https://www.sydney.edu.au/business

In this episode, Nikki Bond joins Professor Sally Gainsbury to discuss the. Nikki heads the UK’s Gambling Harms Action Lab, under the Money and Mental Health Policy Institute. Prior to this she worked across both the financial services and social work sectors, supporting people from marginalised groups.

Together, they examine into how financial institutions can identify problem gambling, through algorithmic analysis. As well as understanding potential conflicts of interest, both for firms and for consumers. Asking, where do we draw the line between help and surveillance?

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We would like to acknowledge the production and editing team

Eunice Huynh, Asha Osporne and Madhu Pelluru

Show notes and links:

Find the Money and Mental Health Policy Institute here https://www.moneyandmentalhealth.org/

Naomi Muggletons “Redefining harm: The role of data integration in understanding gambling behaviour” https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/add.16461

In this episode, Rebecca Glenn joins Professor Sally Gainsbury to explore the relationship between gambling, economic abuse, and domestic and family violence. Rebecca is the Founder and CEO of the Centre for Women's Economic Safety, co-founder of the International Coalition Against Economic Abuse, and a Churchill Fellow whose work has helped shape Australia's response to economic abuse.

The conversation examines how gambling can both contribute to and result from coercive control, creating financial harm that often remains hidden from partners, families, and services. Sally and Rebecca discuss financial literacy, digital banking, coercive control legislation, and the role of financial institutions in recognising and responding to economic abuse.

They also consider the limits of financial capability. If someone is being controlled, is more knowledge enough to improve financial decisions? What responsibilities do governments, banks, gambling operators, and digital platforms have in preventing economic abuse? And how can better systems and policies reduce harm before it becomes entrenched?

Visit BetWell: Bet with more clarity, insight and intention
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We would like to acknowledge the production and editing team

Eunice Huynh, Fergus Lyons, Asha Osporne, Madhu Pelluru

Show notes and links:

• Rebecca Glenn's Churchill Fellowship:
  https://www.churchilltrust.com.au/fellow/rebecca-glenn-vic-2019/

• Financial Safety Website: https://financialsafety.org.au/

• Evidence based resources on domestic, family and sexualised violence.
  https://www.insightexchange.net/

• A practical guide and short video on responding to people experiencing violence and abuse.
  https://www.insightexchange.net/follow-my-lead/

In this episode, Chandni Gupta joins Professor Sally Gainsbury in exploring where persuasion ends and deceptive design begins, what Australia can learn from other jurisdictions, and why regulation matters when consumers are navigating platforms shaped by information asymmetry and commercial incentives.

Chandni is Deputy CEO and Digital Policy Director at the Consumer Policy Research Centre and a 2023 Churchill Fellow. Her research has built Australia’s leading evidence base on deceptive design: the features embedded in websites and apps that steer choices in ways that benefit businesses rather than consumers.

Visit BetWell: Bet with more clarity, insight and intention
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Show notes and links:

• Made to Manipulate: Protecting Consumers in Digital Markets (Chandni Gupta's Churchill Fellowship Report) https://apo.org.au/node/330919

• Australian Government reforms on Unfair Business Practices / Dark Patterns https://treasury.gov.au/consultation/c2024-466491

• Duped by Design: Manipulative Online Design https://cprc.org.au/report/duped-by-design-manipulative-online-design-dark-patterns-in-australia/

• Consumer Policy Research Centre – Digital Consumer Research https://cprc.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2021/12/Digital-checkout-final.pdf

Books

• Deceptive Patterns — Harry Brignull https://deceptive.design/

• Hooked: How to Build Habit Forming Products — Nir Eyal https://www.nirandfar.com/hooked/

• Indistractable — Nir Eyal https://www.nirandfar.com/indistractable/

Podcasts

• I've Got Questions — Sinead Bovell https://open.spotify.com/show/0PBDy9jiLEikDvF6JCWejE

In this episode, Chris Kohler joins Professor Sally Gainsbury to discuss how financial information cuts through in a noisy digital world. Chris is Finance Editor at 9News, author of How They Get You, and host of the podcast How We Got Here. He has also built one of Australia’s largest independent finance audiences, with more than 750,000 followers on Instagram, by explaining complex financial systems clearly and accessibly.

The conversation explores why clear communication matters, especially when products and platforms are deliberately designed to influence consumer behaviour. Chris and Sally discuss how short-form videos can reveal the mechanisms behind pokies, lotteries, sports betting, prediction markets, loyalty schemes, buy-now-pay-later products, and other systems that often work against consumers’ interests.

They also consider the limits of communication. If people understand that a product is designed to influence them, does that knowledge actually change behaviour? What can public-facing communication do that official warnings, academic research, or government messaging often cannot? And where does responsibility sit when legal products are built around psychological pressure, persuasive design, and information imbalance?

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Show notes and links:

Chris Kohler on Instagram: @chriskohlernews

Chris Kohler on YouTube: @ChrisKohlerNews

Chris Kohler on TikTok: @chriskohlernews

Books:

How They Get You by Chris Kohler: Available through Penguin Random House Australia and all good booksellers.

How We Got Here podcast: Available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and Acast.

Australian Government Response: https://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Committees/House/Social_Policy_and_Legal_Affairs/Onlinegamblingimpacts/Government_Response

Note: Correction - The Government Response was released over the Easter long weekend, not the Anzac Day weekend.

Some of our favourites from Chris Kohler:

Pokies: instagram.com/reel/DCQbGEzgvXZ/

Lotteries: youtube.com/shorts/XrENnU5l3hw

Sports betting: instagram.com/reel/DQlN9aoEuqE/

Prediction markets: youtube.com/shorts/HBiWxEPCiWk