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Today's episode is all about royalty. No, not those odd primates shuffling around palaces in crowns and robes, but the monarchs of the butterfly world.

We're joined by Dr. Jaap de Roode, Samuel Candler Dobbs Professor of Biology at Emory University, who's one of the world's experts in insect self-medication.

Yup, you heard that right.

You might have caught one of our episodes (42, 60) with Mike Huffman, who discovered chimpanzees self-medicating in Tanzania to ward off parasites. Well, if you thought that was amazing (it is!), wait'll you hear Jaap talk about monarch butterflies!

After sharing his background in parasitology and population ecology, Jaap describes his work on medicative behaviors in monarch butterflies. From there, we go on to a whole bunch of other topics, like:

• how parasites affect monarch health, especially during their migrations
• the incredible diversity of animal medicative behaviors
• The role of citizen science in monarch conservation
• The importance of science communication in raising awareness

We also talk about Jaap's forthcoming book, Doctors by Nature: How Ants, Apes and Other Animals Heal Themselves, due out from Princeton University Press on March 4, 2025.

When we recorded the interview in spring 2023, Jaap was actually in Japan visiting Mike Huffman to talk about this book, so Mike joined us for the interview.

For anyone whose interested, I noticed that Jaap started a podcast of his own out of Emory University called Virulent Vortex. Check that out if you're interested in "infectious diseases across scales from molecules and pathogens to populations and pandemics, and everything in between" (from their website).

As always, I thoroughly enjoyed having this conversation, and learned a lot from Jaap about butterflies and beyond.

Disclaimer: The PrimateCast in no way, shape or form supports self-medicating with cigarette butts like those inventive urban birds in Mexico!

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The PrimateCast is hosted and produced by Andrew MacIntosh. Artwork by Chris Martin. Music by Andre Goncalves.

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In this episode of The PrimateCast, your host sits down with science communicator Amanda Mathieson, Head of Public Engagement, Education and Communications at Biorbic, Ireland's National Bioeconomy Research Centre.

She's also a pioneer in the space of developing STEM-themed escape rooms. And that was the main topic of discussion in the interview.

Throughout the episode, Amanda offers insightful anecdotes and creative ideas that reveal the potential of escape rooms as educational tools. We uncover the nuances of designing these immersive settings, from overcoming teamwork challenges to incorporating actors to enhance the experience.

About STEM-themed escape rooms, Amanda notes in the interview that, "It really levels the playing field… Gives people a chance to excel at something that is science based but they might think, ‘oh wow, I did that, I beat that, even though I don’t think of myself as a sciency person'."

In an article she coauthored in the journal Research for All, Amanda writes that, "In an engagement scenario, perceived learning may be more valuable than actual learning, as this relates to self-efficacy and the likelihood of continued engagement.”

Amanda paints a vivid picture of how these innovative approaches can promote a love for science and encourage critical thinking, making learning an enjoyable adventure for all ages.

During the pandemic, Amanda also started her own podcast, conversing with science communicators in different fields and exploring how people can get into such roles. We touched on Amanda's own career path in the interview, but to learn more about the field and some of the people in it, check out that limited series podcast here.

In addition to her role at Biorbic, Amanda is also Coordinator of the STEAM Summer School, which provides practical training in communicating science through the arts.

And, she is currently working toward her doctorate at University College Dublin’s Earth Institute, where she studies “play”. We end the interview with a discussion of learning through video games like Age of Empires, and board games like Pandemic and Daybreak.

As Amanda notes in closing, we all need to play more! And if we can do a little learning at the same time? Well, all the better.

Photo Credit: Amanda Mathieson.

Support the show

The PrimateCast is hosted and produced by Andrew MacIntosh. Artwork by Chris Martin. Music by Andre Goncalves.

Here's what you can do to get in touch!

• Connect with us on Facebook, X, or Instagram
• Subscribe where you get your podcasts
• Email theprimatecast@gmail.com with thoughts and comments

If you value the show, leave ratings and reviews wherever it is that you listen, and consider donating by clicking the "Support the Show" link above.

Thanks for being part of The PrimateCast Community!

Send us a text

Explore zoo animal welfare with Dr. Lance J. Miller, a leading authority in animal welfare science at Brookfield Zoo Chicago, formerly Chicago Zoological Society's Brookfield Zoo.

Lance is Vice President of Animal Welfare Science at Brookfield Zoo Chicago, but he also holds a slough of other appointments.

He’s Chair of the Alliance of Marine Mammal Parks and Aquariums Animal Welfare Committee, an Advisor to the Association of Zoos and Aquariums’ (AZA) Research and Technology Committee, Animal Welfare Committee, and the Behavioral Scientific Advisory Group, and he’s a Steering Committee Member for AZA’s Ambassador Animal Scientific Advisory Group.

Lance is also internationally active in the field, currently serving as the Vice-Chair for the World Association of Zoos and Aquarium's (WAZA) Ethics and Animal Welfare Committee, and as Chair of the WAZA Ethics Subcommittee.

There's a lot to take in here. We talk about:

• the difference between animal rights and welfare
• going beyond the five freedoms to providing opportunities to thrive
• the cetacean welfare study - the largest multi-institutional study of cetacean welfare in existence
• behavioral diversity, behavioral stereotypies, and other indicators of indicator of animal welfare
• how technology like Zoo PhysioTrack and ZooMonitor are reshaping the landscape of animal welfare monitoring
• the ethics of animals in zoos and the perceptions of visitors in relation to conservation and welfare

This episode will enrich your understanding of a complex, interdisciplinary field that blends science and ethics and showcases in the best case human compassion and commitment to the animals we keep at zoos and aquariums.

I hope you enjoy the conversation!

Support the show

The PrimateCast is hosted and produced by Andrew MacIntosh. Artwork by Chris Martin. Music by Andre Goncalves.

Here's what you can do to get in touch!

• Connect with us on Facebook, X, or Instagram
• Subscribe where you get your podcasts
• Email theprimatecast@gmail.com with thoughts and comments

If you value the show, leave ratings and reviews wherever it is that you listen, and consider donating by clicking the "Support the Show" link above.

Thanks for being part of The PrimateCast Community!