In this episode, Hobbs Magaret, author of Herd: Animals That Gave Rise to Humanity and Why We Need Them More Than Ever, joins Cal for a deep, thought-provoking conversation about grazing, ecology, and shifting our perspectives on livestock production. Hobbs shares his journey from ranching in Oregon to working on massive cattle stations in Australia, blending personal experience with philosophical insights. The discussion explores high density grazing, the role of herd animals in human history, how to market regenerative beef, and the radical idea of viewing beef as a waste product rather than the main goal. Along the way, Hobbs touches on corporate politics, ecological ideals, genetic selection for fertility, and the lessons learned from managing vastly different environments.

Topics Covered

• Hobbs Magaret’s background and ranching journey in the U.S. and Australia
• The origins of his interest in high density grazing (influences from Allan Savory and Johann Zietsman)
• Moving from a protein-production mindset to an ecological-function mindset
• The concept of beef as a waste product instead of a byproduct
• Lessons learned from grazing in Oregon vs. Texas vs. Northern Australia
• Managing corporate politics while implementing ecological changes
• Performance art and visibility in agriculture marketing
• Using social media (TikTok & Instagram) to grow influence and sell beef
• The role of hindgut fermenters in ecosystems and simulating their function with ruminants
• Genetic adaptation and breed considerations for different environments
• The importance of fertility as the key livestock selection criterion
• Marketing strategies and the value of storytelling in agriculture

If you’re interested in the future of regenerative ranching, this episode will challenge your assumptions and spark new ideas. Hobbs brings a rare combination of large-scale experience, ecological philosophy, and practical know-how. Whether you’re grazing a few acres or managing thousands, his insights into livestock genetics, grazing strategy, and the deeper purpose of ruminants will help you think differently about your land, your herd, and your role as a steward.

Resources Mentioned

• Herd: Animals That Gave Rise to Humanity and Why We Need Them More Than Ever by Hobbs Magaret
• Allan Savory’s work and holistic management principles
• Man, Cattle and Veld by Johann Zietsman
• How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie

Looking for Livestock that thrive on grass? Check out Grass Based Genetics

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Chapters

• (00:00) - Introduction and Fast Five Questions
• (00:52) - Career Journey and Ranching Experience
• (09:57) - High Density Grazing and Ecological Insights
• (30:53) - Marketing and Social Media Success
• (32:23) - Writing the Book and Philosophical Reflections
• (45:49) - The Central Thesis: Ecologically Aligned Beef
• (46:46) - Controversial Insights on American Cattle Industry
• (48:07) - Historical Context and Ecological Impact
• (49:53) - The Paradigm Shift: Profitability vs. Sustainability
• (01:01:14) - Genetics and Fertility in Cattle Breeding
• (01:02:11) - Ecological Adaptation and Market Realities
• (01:05:36) - Global Perspectives on Cattle Breeding
• (01:17:44) - The Role of Hindgut Fermenters in Grazing Systems
• (01:20:01) - Final Thoughts and Reflections

In this episode of the Grazing Grass Podcast, Cal visits with Jaime Elizondo, known as Jim in the United States, to explore his Total Grazing Program. This is a comprehensive approach to regenerative ranching focused on lowering costs, improving soil, and increasing livestock performance. With decades of experience managing cattle in Mexico and the U.S., Jim shares his path from red cattle in the tropics to creating a composite breed suited for harsh environments. He breaks down the importance of African Bos taurus genetics, how to build soil carbon, and the strategies behind stockpiling and grazing timing. Listeners will come away with a deeper understanding of how to manage grazing with nature, not against it.

In this episode, you’ll hear about:

• Jim’s story from Mexico to Texas and the foundation of his farm, Las Coloradas
• His evolution from red cattle to developing an adapted composite breed
• The significance of African Bos taurus genetics in hot, humid, and disease-prone environments
• What the Total Grazing Program is and how it differs from ultra high-density grazing
• How to build long-lived soil carbon and why it matters
• Stockpiling strategies for winter and how to boost soil and forage health
• Monitoring livestock performance with gut fill and body condition
• The role of coaching and mentorship in successful grazing operations
• Applying these grazing principles to cattle, sheep, and goats

If you're interested in cutting input costs, improving soil, and raising animals that thrive in your environment, this episode delivers a practical and proven system. Jim offers clear guidance based on firsthand experience. Whether you're on a small farm or a large ranch, his insights can help you improve your land and your bottom line.

Resources Mentioned:

• Grass Productivity by André Voisin
• Man Must Measure by Jan Bonsma
• A Sand County Almanac by Aldo Leopold
• The Forage Book by Hutchinson and Metcalf
• Jim’s paper “Soil Carbon” (available on his website)

Looking for Livestock that thrive on grass? Check out Grass Based Genetics

Visit our Sponsors:
Noble Research Institute

Redmond Agriculture

Grazing Grass Links
New Listener Resource Guide

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Chapters

Joel shares his inspiring journey from business economics and tech startups to building a fast-growing regenerative ranch. He explains how he used herd shares and ultra high density grazing to expand from a small herd to nearly 500 cows in just a few years. Along the way, he discusses developing hardy genetics, navigating serious labor shortages, and creating a supportive network of investors and mentors. Joel blends economics, history, faith, and land stewardship into a powerful vision for the future of ranching.

Topics Covered:

• Launching a ranch with zero capital through herd share partnerships
• Choosing Oklahoma for its climate challenges and opportunities
• Lessons from tech and startup life that apply to ranching
• Ultra high density grazing and how it multiplies carrying capacity
• Genetic selection for cattle that thrive without inputs
• Using community and social capital to scale
• The hidden economics behind modern ranch failure
• Advice for young or aspiring regenerative ranchers

Why You Should Listen:

This episode offers a rare look into what it takes to build a large-scale regenerative operation from the ground up. Joel is not only focused on grazing methods but also on solving the deeper economic, cultural, and logistical problems facing ranchers today. His practical strategies and vision for the future will resonate with anyone serious about making a living on the land.

Resources Mentioned:

• Smoke River Ranch
• Book: Man, Cattle & the Grass by Johann Zietsman
• Joel’s handle: @untappedgrowth on X/Twitter

Looking for Livestock that thrive on grass? Check out Grass Based Genetics

Visit our Sponsors:
Noble Research Institute

Redmond Agriculture

Grazing Grass Links
New Listener Resource Guide

Provide feedback for the podcast
Website
Insiders
Resources
Community (on Facebook)
Check out the Apiary Chronicles Podcast

• (00:00) - Introduction and Fast Five Questions
• (00:21) - Challenges in Labor and Livestock Management
• (02:30) - Labor Issues and Solutions
• (07:38) - Podcast Introduction and Sponsor Message
• (09:20) - Farm Updates and Podcast Announcements
• (12:30) - Joel's Journey into Farming
• (12:49) - Health Crisis and Nutritional Discoveries
• (16:20) - Educational Background and Career Path
• (18:50) - Starting the Ranch and Bitcoin Investment
• (27:05) - Scaling the Ranch and Herd Share Program
• (39:24) - Challenges and Strategies in Modern Ranching
• (49:37) - The Impact of Historical Agricultural Practices
• (50:03) - The Evolution of American Agriculture
• (51:07) - Challenges and Innovations in Modern Ranching
• (51:48) - The Herd Share Arrangement
• (53:06) - Ultra High Density Grazing
• (55:07) - Building a Supportive Ranching Community
• (56:15) - The Importance of Hardy Cattle Breeds
• (01:07:46) - Scaling and Adapting to High Density Grazing
• (01:14:44) - Future Innovations and Tools for Ranching
• (01:18:29) - Famous Four Questions
• (01:34:31) - Conclusion and Final Thoughts