I’m halfway through the year and, like many of you, I feel as if it’s still February. Orders are steady but not spectacular, and every headline seems designed to keep shop owners awake at night. That’s why I invited my friend and financing partner Ty Willis back on Buy the Numbers—because cautious optimism only works if your cash flow can keep up with your ambitions. Ty funds machine tools every day, from three-spindle startups to $40 million fab shops, so he sees the real score behind the press releases. In this conversation we pull the veil off equipment financing: when to borrow, when to walk away, and how to keep your banker, your line of credit, and your future robots playing nicely together. We also unpack why a “slow-and-steady foundation” beats any shiny new five-axis—unless that five-axis comes with the cash-flow runway to feed it. You’ll hear Ty’s three phases of lending wisdom, my own war stories of growing Hill Manufacturing (including a 24-spindle acquisition we’re closing in two weeks), and a practical playbook for calling your shot six months before you sign a PO. We even run a lightning round on interest rates, Section 179, and whether the latest “no payments for six months” gimmick is really a deal. If you’re tired of financing offers that treat every shop the same—or tired of hearing “rates are too high, maybe next year”—this episode gives you the numbers, questions, and mindset to finance growth without betting the farm. You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in... (0:00) Ty’s “run lean first” mantra and why slow & steady wins the race(0:25) Check out Verdant Commercial Capital to gain a partner in your corner(1:30) Ty’s path from tech to ten years in independent equipment finance(4:53) Job shops are softer, DOD/aerospace is humming, and diversification is critical(10:09) Using cash flow as the real growth lever; the 24-spindle acquisition example(11:49) Ty’s three phases of lending maturity (valuing consultative restraint over volume)(17:36) Case study: consolidating eight lenders into one partner to free a CFO’s week(22:33) Automation financing myths—why cobots and AGVs often outlive spindles and deserve funding(26:40) Sign up for updates about Modern Machine Shop’s Top Shops 2025(27:04) Breathing new life into 15-year-old machines with robots, bar feeders, better workholding(29:52) Pre-qualification and “calling your shot” before IMTS or FABTECH(33:27) South-Dakota-to-Florida move: financing a $500K 5-axis and hidden relocation costs(37:41) Chicago fab/machine shop’s methodical growth with bargain used five-axis machines(41:42) Ty’s four-step engagement playbook: 20-minute call, one-page soft-pull app, roadmap, relationship(44:19) Lightning round: rates, imperfect books, Section 179 reality, deferred-payment traps(55:28) Why you need to listen to the Lights Out podcast Resources & People Mentioned Smart Money Moves: Equipment Financing Tips with Ty Willis, Ep #5The Cashflow Advantage: Why the Right Banker Makes All the Difference, Ep #6Banking Secrets for Manufacturers: How to Secure the Cash You Need, Ep #12Sign up for updates about Modern Machine Shop’s Top Shops 2025Why we leverage the expertise of CliftonLarsonAllen Connect with Ty Willis Check out Verdant Commercial Capital to gain a partner in your cornerVerdant Commercial Capital on LinkedInConnect with Ty on LinkedIn Connect With Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedInConnect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK
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