What’s rarer than viral growth, and more powerful than performance marketing?

Sustained Advocacy.

It’s what the brands on this show have built, and what this 100th episode is here to celebrate.

To mark the special milestone, Paul & Verity are looking back on the unforgettable moments, tactics, and truths from 100 conversations with the sharpest minds in brand building – the CMOs, Founders, and community-first Marketers behind some of the world’s fastest-growing names.

This is more than a recap. It’s a look ahead to where marketing is heading next.

Hit play to learn how to…

• Build With, Not For: Advocacy-first brands don’t sell at their audience – they co-create with them. From skincare brands embracing mixed-brand content to companies inviting creators into the strategy room, the path forward is participatory.

• Scale Without Losing Soul: From The Inkey List’s £100M+ brand honesty to Beekman 1802’s gamified kindness, the most loved brands lead with how they do things, not just what they sell. Culture isn't the garnish. It's the growth engine.

• Trade Vanity For Substance: Forget follower counts. Nanos & micros are winning: because they educate, convert, and care more. Real fans > rented reach. Brands like REFY, Never Fully Dressed, and Symprove are proving that depth leads to scale, when building trust.

• Make Your Tactics Transparent: Today’s marketers are done with vague playbooks. The best ones don’t just share philosophy – they share the numbers. Budgets, CAC, conversion rates, channel tests. It’s what the industry needs; a space for open, actionable learning.

Whether you’ve listened to one episode or all 100, this one marks a turning point.

Because the brands that will thrive in the next 10 years aren’t chasing trends. They’re building for Advocacy.

Press play. Learn from the best. Build what lasts.

Chapters

00:00 Kicking Off With A Vocal Warm-Up

01:10 What Brand Advocacy Really Means

02:26 Celebrating 100 Episodes of the Podcast

04:23 What 100 Episodes Taught Us

08:32 Why Tactical Marketing Matters

11:11 What Surprised Us

15:27 What’s Next & Why Feedback Fuels It

16:31 Episodes Worth Repeating

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Connect with Paul & Verity:

On Paul’s LinkedIn

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Why do polished brands stall, while real ones build Advocacy?

Because today’s consumers don’t want perfection. They want proof.

This week, Erica Cocilova (Chief Executive Officer @ Ethique Beauty) joins Verity in New York to unpack why substance, imperfection, and product obsession are the future of brand building. From rebrands & B Corp audits to salon takeovers that win over skeptics, Erica’s approach proves brand trust isn’t bought – it’s built.

Solid product, transparent leadership, and customer service that actually puts you in contact with the CEO? They’re the building blocks to scaling with integrity.

Rethink what brand love looks like, as you learn…

• How To Build Advocacy Through Service, Beyond Storytelling: Every customer DM, email, and piece of outreach gets a reply; and it’s personal. Real care builds real loyalty. It’s about accountability, not automation, when you build Advocacy this way.

• Ways To Turn IRL Conversations Into Scalable Content: From salon takeovers to consumer-led debates on hair washing habits, Erica shares how small, real-world moments are fuelling content that converts – and creating better educated, enthusiastic Advocates in the process.

• How To Audit Your Brand’s True Impact: Erica’s first move at Ethique was to strip back 20+ sustainability claims and anchor the brand to one: eliminating plastic. Learn how to run an impact audit that narrows focus, sharpens storytelling, and guides strategy.

• Advice For Taking Bold, Human Decisions In Public: Erica and her team didn’t hide behind the rebrand, they fronted it. Blogs, open Slack huddles; even customer support tickets answered by the CFO. Transparency isn’t a ‘for the sake of it’ tactic for Ethique, but is part of the team’s culture.

• Why Bridging Purpose & Product Should Be Seamless: Ethique’s haircare bars aren’t sustainable in spite of their format – they’re better because of it. Function & mission shouldn’t compete. They should compound.

This is what it sounds like when a brand listens, adapts, and leads without losing its soul.

Chapters

00:00 Turning Skeptics into Believers

03:30 Branding at the Crossroads of Sustainability & Efficacy

08:40 What It Takes to Become a B Corp

12:34 Staying Real with Brand Purpose

14:36 Building a Community That Advocates

18:42 Starting Real Conversations with Consumers

20:41 Why Inclusive Events Build Stronger Communities

23:39 Authentic Engagement Starts with Listening

24:36 How Brand Advocates Are Made

25:56 Why First Impressions Still Matter

27:12 Shifting the Consumer Mindset

28:34 What Legacy Brands Got Right

29:45 Direct-to-Consumer: What the Data Shows

32:52 Moving Past Fear to Innovate

36:14 Building Culture Through Transparency

37:26 Rebranding to Be Understood

39:36 Helping Consumers Choose Simply

41:53 Why Scalp Care Deserves the Spotlight

42:22 Getting the Brand Message Right

43:47 Advocacy Is Built on Connection

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Connect with Erica:

Via her team @ Ethique

Via Ethique’s Instagram

How do some brands thrive on social while others struggle to make an impact?

The best know they’re not just competing with other brands – they’re competing with viral creators, meme accounts, and even second-screens.

So, here’s your tactical framework for standing out in the never-ending scroll.

This week, Miranda Shanahan (Brand Consultant & Content Creator on @mirandadoesbrands) joins Verity to break down how brands can win attention, keep it, and convert it into lasting impact. With a career spent dissecting what makes content perform (and what makes it flop), Miranda offers tried & tested advice for short-form success.

By now, it’s clear – brands need to think like creators. The ones that do are building entertainment-first content worlds, owning trends instead of chasing them, and turning social engagement into real business results.

Turn this episode on and up to learn how to…

• Ditch The ‘Viral’ Mentality & Build A Repeatable Content Engine: Going viral is not a strategy. Miranda explains why the brands that win are the ones who nail scalable, signature content formats – and why 90% of your content should be proven, with 10% for experimentation.

• Stop Competing With Other Brands & Hold Your Own Against Creators: You’re up against influencers, memes, and multi-screen distractions (like YouTube or Netflix). Brands that only benchmark against competitors are already behind. Instead, Miranda shares how to create content that holds attention in a TikTok-first world.

• Why Short-Form Must Deliver One or Both of These: Entertainment + Value = the key to short-form. Miranda breaks down the forumla to creating memorable, shareable content – and why the biggest mistake brands make is overcomplicating it.

• Nail Your Hooks & Micro-Engagements: Most brands can get the first three seconds of content right, but lose attention soon after. Learn why the most effective short-form content is structured around multiple hooks – visual, verbal, and text – layered throughout to keep people engaged until the last second.

• See Why The Future Is Social TV: From LuvJus’ dating show to Mela’s creator-led mini-series, brands are acting like content studios. The best part? You don’t need Netflix-level budgets to do it; only Miranda’s advice & some dedication.

Listen, learn, and start creating content people will actually want to watch.

Rate & review Building Brand Advocacy:

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Connect with Miranda:

On TikTok

On LinkedIn

Chapters

00:00 – Why branding with personality is the only way to stand out

01:45 – Brand Advocacy 101: What the best get right

02:47 – Short-form content is the battleground for attention

06:56 – Legacy brands vs. disruptors: Who’s winning and why it matters

08:44 – The viral illusion: What actually drives brand growth

12:01 – Not every trend is worth your time, here’s how to decide

14:30 – How to craft scroll-stopping content that actually engages

18:08 – Founder-led content isn’t enough anymore

20:58 – Storytelling that sells: The balance of entertainment & value

24:02 – Going niche to go big: Why the smallest audiences build the biggest brands

26:01 – The social TV era: Why more brands are becoming broadcasters

27:59 – Creators and brands are uniting in new ways: Here’s how to do it right

30:58 – Frameworks that actually work (and scale) for brand content

35:00 – Most brands ignore these hidden growth tracks

Most brands see influencer content as single posts, even when they’re part of long-term partnerships.

The best brands see these posts as the start of entire campaigns.

Creators are more than marketing channels – they’re shaping culture, setting trends, and even launching products that outperform legacy brands.

This week, Paul welcomes Keith Bendes (Forbes Contributor, Creator Expert & VP of Strategy @ Linqia) to the podcast. Having spent years advising global brands, Keith knows the most impactful ratio of brand-to-creator content, why “unsexy” industries actually need creators the most, and how smart brands are using a mix of CGC (Customer-Generated Content) & paid media to scale trust at speed.

You’ll learn how to:

• Go From One Post to Full-Funnel Impact: The strongest brands don’t solely run influencer campaigns – they integrate content from each one into every marketing touchpoint. The same creator content that wins on TikTok should be repurposed across paid, CTV, and even OOH.

• Partner with Influencers Before They Compete with You: Creators are selling products, yes. They’re also launching their own. Nestlé’s Unwell Hydration with Alex Cooper proves how brands can get in on the action: collaborate now, or risk competing later.

• Know the Difference Between CGC, UGC & Influencers: “The people with the following are the ones who build the culture”, Keith says. While CGC (Creator-Generated Content) & UGC (User-Generated Content) fuel performance, influencers set the tone. Expect tactical advice for using all three.

• The Future of Social Commerce & TikTok Shop: Affiliate strategies work, but don’t mix them with influencer campaigns. If you want creators to build brand equity, don’t turn them into salespeople.

• What Brands Keep Getting Wrong: You can’t buy your way into relevance. The brands that win are the ones creating something people want to be part of.

Rethink how you’re working with creator content, before you fall behind.

Chapters

00:00 – Building Brand Culture for Advocacy

02:03 – How Influencer Marketing Has Evolved

04:07 – Winning Strategies for Brand Engagement

06:14 – Earning Trust in “Unsexy” Industries

09:06 – The Trust Factor in Content Creation

13:41 – Where Paid Media Meets Influencer Strategy

15:53 – Why Influencer Marketing Matters More Than Ever

17:21 – Leveraging User-Generated Content for Growth

20:06 – What’s Next for Content Creation?

23:05 – How Brands and Creators Build Together

31:54 – The Changing Advice for Marketing Campaigns

39:10 – The Future of Short-Form Video

42:35 – Mastering Affiliate Marketing for Growth

46:09 – Balancing Brand Equity with Sales Targets

51:06 – Community, Culture & the Future of Brand Advocacy

Rate & review Building Brand Advocacy:

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Connect with Keith:

On LinkedIn

Via Linqia’s Website

Hear more from Keith on his podcast, Creator Economy Live!

Some brand-creator partnerships feel forced. Others just work.

Real Advocacy is the difference.

This week, Verity sits down with Francesca Kelly (Co-Founder @ Soru Jewellery) to break down how collaboration, not control, has fueled the brand’s growth.

No rigid contracts. No paid influencer posts. Just long-term partnerships built on mutual excitement – leading to years-long collaborations, a global audience, and even a viral moment thanks to The Kate Effect™.

Here, Francesca gets real on her Founder’s journey to share how you can…

• Find Creators Who Actually Want to Wear Your Brand: Soru Jewellery has never paid for a post. Instead, they gift, reward & collaborate with creators – like Laura Wills (@thefashionbugblog) and Arielle Charnas – who already wear and love their pieces.

• Keep the Buzz Going After Launch: Forget one-off campaigns. Soru’s partnerships thrive long after release day because both the brand and its collaborators keep wearing and talking about the pieces.

• Let Customer Feedback Shape Product: When fans loved a collection but wanted a lower price point, Soru listened. The result = a second drop that was even more successful than the first.

• Be Ready for Unexpected Virality: When Kate Middleton wore Soru earrings twice in two days, the press went wild. Francesca shares how they handled the sudden global attention, and what they learned from it.

If your brand is looking to build real Advocacy (not just follower counts), this episode is a masterclass in letting go of control – and winning because of it.

Turn it on. Take notes. Start collaborating like you mean it.

Chapters

00:00 – Why Brand-Creator Relationships Need Trust

02:09 – How Soru Jewellery Built a Creator Network Without Paid Posts

07:49 – Common Challenges in Creator Partnerships (& How to Solve Them)

10:56 – Why Customer Feedback Shapes Soru’s Approach

14:32 – The Evolution of Brand Advocacy & Long-Term Collaboration

16:26 – How Social Media Drives Growth Without Ads

21:04 – Soru Jewellery’s Founder Story: From Idea to Global Brand

23:58 – Community-Led Growth: Why It Works for Soru

28:00 – The Reality of Content Creation as a Founder

30:09 – Finding New Opportunities in Emerging Markets

31:40 – Taking the Leap: Why Soru May Open a Physical Store

35:53 – The Kate Effect™: When a Royal Wears Your Brand

38:51 – How Soru Keeps Customers Coming Back

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Connect with Francesca:

Via Soru’s Instagram

Via Soru’s TikTok

Brands are starting to get serious about Advocacy.

Few understand what it takes to build it.

Here’s the truth: You can’t buy real Advocacy. You have to earn it.

That’s exactly what Carol McEvoy (Head of Social, PR & Advocacy @ Symprove) has spent years perfecting. From gut health to brand health, Carol and her team have built one of the most genuinely trusted communities in wellness. No shortcuts. No gimmicks. Just real people sharing real experiences – because they want to.

Sitting down with Verity, Carol unpacks what brands get wrong about Advocacy. She shares expert insight & first-hand success tactics from Symprove’s journey to get things right, too.

Let’s get into why you should…

• Stop Confusing Advocacy With Influencer Marketing:Brands that rely solely on paid partnerships miss out on the organic, long-term impact of real brand fans. Carol explains why influencers can be Advocates, but not all Advocates are influencers.

• Build Advocacy From Within:Employees should be your first Advocates, as passionate teams create passionate communities. Learn how Symprove ensures its entire internal teambelieves in the product before asking anyone else to.

• Remember Anyone Can Advocate:Many brands fixate on creators, but true Advocacy happens in doctor’s offices, group chats, and real-life conversations. Symprove sees everyone who shares their experience (whether a creator, a professional, or a loyal customer) as a potential Advocate with the power to drive real impact.

• Forget The Shiny Objects:It’s easy to get distracted by trends and competitor noise, but real Advocacy isn’t built on hype. Carol shares how Symprove has stayed laser-focused on its mission, proving that word-of-mouth beats short-term marketing tricks every time.

Brand Advocacy is never a short-term hack. It’s a long-term advantage.

If you want your brand to survive the next decade, this is how you get Advocacy right.

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Connect with Carol:

On LinkedIn

Via Symprove’s Website

The best brands aren’t just broadcasting. They’re building with their audiences.

Welcome to a special Advocacy 101 episode, where we remix four expert insights on what’s next into one tactical guide.

Jo Bird (Creative Consultant | ex-Lounge, ex-Gymshark), Holly Chapman (Head of Brand @ Papier), Victoria Blinova (Senior Strategic Partner Manager @ YouTube), and Lia Haberman (Creator Economy Expert) break down the key shifts shaping content, creators & the social media landscape in 2025.

Tune it to learn why you should:

• Co-Create at Scale: Broadcast channels, TikTok Lives, and real-time audience input are more than engagement tools – they’re shaping the future of brand strategy. Hear how REFY, Gymshark, and Papier are turning everyday consumers into collaborators from Jo & Holly.

• Balance Short-Form & Long-Form for Maximum Impact: Short form grabs attention, but long form builds deep relationships. Victoria & Holly know the smartest brands are mixing viral moments with docu-series, podcasts, and Substack sponsorships to create lasting impact.

• Leverage Live Commerce & Personal Branding: Founders aren’t just behind the scenes anymore. Ben Francis (Gymshark), Aimee Smale (Odd Muse), and Ben Gallaga (Luxe Collective) prove that when brand leaders step in front of the camera, conversions skyrocket – as told by Jo.

• Let Go, But With a Process: Handing over creative control to influencers sounds scary, but structured workflows make it seamless. Learn how the best brands are balancing creative freedom with clear KPIs and approval processes via Victoria.

• Prepare For The Rise of Alternative Content: Carousels aren’t just photo dumps anymore. Swipe-left storytelling, Pinterest collages, and mid-form content are on the rise. Find out how to use them to stand out, from Lia.

Listen in. Take notes. Evolve your strategy.

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Connect with Jo, Holly, Victoria & Lia:

On Jo’s LinkedIn

On Holly’s LinkedIn

On Victoria’s LinkedIn

On Lia’s LinkedIn

Catch their full episodes:

Jo on Brand Storytelling

Holly on Papier’s Brand Strategy

Victoria on Cracking The Video Code

Lia on How To Win On Social in 2025