This week, Bren and Lenno ask whether data leaders need to be in the code, or whether the job is something else entirely.

Lenno shares why vibe-coded output makes him want to understand code well enough to check it, and why a team of five pulls him closer to the detail than a team of 140 ever did. Bren, an accountant by trade, admits he's never written code and has always wondered when he'd be found out.

They land on the harder question. If specialist work and leading people are different muscles, why do so many companies still treat management as the only way up?

Their answer keeps coming back to trust, and whether your team picks up the phone when things go wrong.

Takeaways

• Leadership is an art, not a science
• Understanding technical aspects is crucial for non-technical leaders

Chapters

• 00:00 The Journey Begins: Running and Reflection
• 03:21 Navigating Imposter Syndrome in Leadership
• 08:12 The Balance of Technical and Non-Technical Skills
• 14:30 The Importance of People Skills in Leadership
• 20:11 Building Relationships in a Digital World
• 25:34 The Art of Leadership and Team Dynamics

This week, Bren and Lenno, ask what happens when we rename things that already had an established name. Yes, here's looking at you "super intelligence"...

Lenno tells the story of how a team renaming an SAP table in plain business terms made data easier to read and harder to build on. Whilst Bren recalls a business that had seven names for the same report.

The bigger question starts with governance and both discussion how agrees what the words mean and how much of it does a business actually need?

Their answer keeps coming back to one word.

Takeaways

• Terminology impacts understanding
• Standardisation is crucial for clarity

Chapters

• 00:00 The Weather and Personal Updates
• 01:22 Super Intelligence vs. Artificial Intelligence
• 02:35 Terminology and Governance in Data
• 05:51 The Importance of Standardization
• 08:38 Changing Terminology and Its Implications
• 10:21 The Role of AI in Data Understanding
• 16:03 Governance and Its Necessity
• 19:29 Bridging the Gap Between Data and Business
• 20:27 Curiosity and Communication in Data
• 21:27 Establishing Commonality in Terminology
• 25:35 The Dichotomy of Data and Business Needs
• 28:02 The Foundation of Data Systems
• 32:37 The Future of Data Governance
• 34:40 Closing Thoughts and Reflections

This week Bren is joined by guest Jamie Fry as Lenno is enjoying some well-earned time off. Jamie runs the Hawkfry Group, a consortium of senior cloud and data specialists, as the conversation dives into the real returns made on using AI.

Jamie puts a real number on it and explains where his teams lean on AI the most. But the real question is where does the human still have the biggest impact?

The discussion looks at the conundrum faced by AI speeding up the technical work but the human work being a bottleneck. And what should companies do to get started with AI?

It's a cracker as we learn the revenue uplift this year for the Hawkfry group from AI and why Jamie has taken more holidays now than the previous 3 years.

Hawkfry Group: https://hawkfry.com/

Jamie Fry Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fryjamie/

Takeaways

• AI enhances business efficiency
• Understanding client needs is crucial AI enhances productivity
• Understanding AI is crucial

Chapters

• 00:00 Introduction to Hawke Fry Group
• 02:55 Leveraging AI for Business Growth
• 06:35 The Importance of Problem Understanding
• 07:42 Measuring AI ROI in Projects
• 10:03 Human Interaction in AI Processes
• 11:23 Delivering Value Beyond Cost
• 12:50 Future-Proofing with Multimodal AI
• 14:59 Building AI-Driven Operations
• 18:29 Integrating AI into Business Operations
• 20:02 The Impact of AI on Work-Life Balance
• 22:14 Navigating Burnout and AI
• 24:44 Building a Supportive Work Environment
• 26:30 Rethinking Payment Structures in AI
• 27:45 Getting Started with AI

This week, Bren and Lenno are still reminiscing about the CXO Data Summit in Crete, but they dive straight into a question that follows them into every boardroom...what does "data first," "AI first," or "cloud first" actually mean?

Lenno questions whether it's really just about fixing whatever's in front of you and calling it a plan. And Bren lays out his theory that 80% of businesses are successful enough to never really need to change, so they throw money at data and AI initiatives without ever fully believing in them.

The episode revolves around what really drives change, and what happens to the companies that keep buying the buzzwords instead of tackling problems?

Takeaways

• Problem-first approach
• Influence of mindset and collaboration
• Challenges of data ownership
• Impact of data and AI on businesses

Chapters

• 00:00 The Impact of Data and AI on Businesses
• 02:40 Challenges of Data Ownership
• 04:19 The Role of Data Professionals
• 06:33 Influence of Mindset and Collaboration
• 09:26 Freedom and Curiosity in Data Initiatives
• 18:36 Driving Change in Business
• 26:05 The Role of Data Professionals in Business Evolution
• 33:16 The Need for a Problem-First Approach

This week, Bren and Lenno are joined by Peter Laflin, a chief data officer who's spent the summer researching what it takes for neurodivergent leaders to thrive in data and AI teams.

Peter shares what he's learned about building high-performing teams and creating genuinely inclusive environments for neurodivergent individuals.

The conversation also touches on the leadership challenges and opportunities in managing a neurodiverse team. One question stands out...how many teams have been quietly built in one leader's image, filtering out the very differences that would have solved their hardest problems?

This is a conversation about building teams that think differently on purpose, not by accident.

Takeaways

• Neurodiversity in the workplace
• Leadership and neurodiversity

Chapters

• 00:00 Introduction to Neurodiversity
• 08:27 Understanding Neurodivergent Individuals
• 21:09 Leadership and Neurodiversity

This week, Bren and Lenno record face-to-face for the first time at the CXO Data Summit in Crete, on what makes a transformation succeed.

Lenno tells the story of the first SAP program, one that had to be pulled apart mid-flight. This painful lesson meant the next one, built on those battle scars, came in pain-free, on time and under budget.

That's the essence of the episode...real capability comes from getting it wrong first. So what happens when AI removes the junior roles where those mistakes used to be made before becoming a data leader?

Takeaways

• People are central to the success of transformation initiatives.
• Experience and learning from past mistakes are crucial for personal and professional growth. Transformation and experience are essential for growth.
• Behaviour change is hard, and people problems are a significant challenge in data leadership.

Chapters

• 00:00 The Importance of People in Transformation
• 01:16 Challenges of Transformation
• 03:07 The Value of Experience in Learning and Growth
• 15:13 Transformation and Experience
• 16:18 People Problems and Behavior Change
• 17:28 The Impact of Technology on the Workplace
• 18:15 Influence of Generational Differences
• 19:13 The Role of Data Leaders in Shaping the Future of Work
• 19:28 The Importance of Communication and Education
• 20:26 Individuality and the Human Component in Data Leadership

This week, Bren and Lenno are joined by their first guest, Alberto Gonzalo Otero, a purpose coach who helps leaders and teams reconnect daily work with why they do it.

Alberto talks through the power of "why," the questions he uses to get people past surface answers like money, and the team assessment he built to measure purpose and psychological safety alongside trust and clarity.

The conversation also looks at courage and the relationship with purpose, and why staying in a role that doesn't fit your purpose is usually the bigger risk.

They discuss how understanding and aligning with your purpose can lead to greater fulfilment, better decision-making, and navigating technological changes like AI.

Guest

Alberto Gonzalez Otero - https://www.linkedin.com/in/albertogotero/

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Alberto Gonzalo Otero and Purpose

00:59 What is Purpose and Why It Matters

03:04 Purpose During the COVID-19 Pandemic

05:03 AI, Technology, and the Future of Work

07:05 The Midlife Crisis and Purpose

08:07 Purpose Across Generations

09:01 The Impact of AI on Jobs and Society

10:57 Using Purpose to Make Better Decisions

13:12 The Role of Leadership and Team Dynamics

15:57 The Value of Purpose in Innovation and Technology

20:09 Balancing Technology and Human Values

24:05 Aligning Work with Personal Purpose

28:04 The Power of Asking 'Why' and Purpose

32:58 Team Dynamics and Purpose

37:08 The Courage to Follow Your Purpose

41:09 Overcoming Societal and Personal Barriers

43:57 Practical Steps to Discover Your Purpose

44:55 Closing Remarks and Final Thoughts

This week, Bren & Lenno venture into the world of security, starting with a media company whose entire channel went completely offline. Not because of a sophisticated breach, but because of a simple but stupid human action.

This episode digs into why data sovereignty and geopolitics get all the corporate attention, while the far bigger risk sits closer to home.

And ultimately they address the question that you can spend a billion dollars on security, but what's the point if it only takes one person to undo it?