My conversation with David Perell, host of the "How I Write" podcast and a truly prolific creator, took my understanding to a whole new level. He's one of the few people who has consistently challenged my thinking on how we communicate ideas effectively. In this episode, I dove deep with David into critical questions like: Does writing still hold its weight in today's crowded digital landscape? What specific elements should creators prioritize to make their words resonate? And importantly, how do you stand out when everyone else is shouting? David shares his incredible insights into the craft of writing, the power of observation, and his unique philosophy on identifying and leveraging "currents" to amplify your message. This was easily one of my favorite conversations on the show.

Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction

01:15 Obsessed with the Craft of Writing

02:45 The "Bit" as a Writing Concept

05:10 Why People Struggle with Writing

07:11 From Seeking Attention to Having Something to Say

10:40 The Discipline of Public Writing

13:58 Capturing and Curating Ideas

20:05 Riding Internet Currents

26:50 Identifying and Leveraging Currents

32:10 Tying Timeless Ideas to Timely Moments

39:15 Uncorrelated Sources of Inspiration

45:36 The "How I Write" Podcast

47:20 Production Value and Set Design

1:00:40 YouTube Growth and Packaging

1:04:40 The Guest Maximization Strategy

1:10:00 Creating "The Modern World" Series

1:16:00 The Modern Pollution of Man-Made Environment

1:19:30 Interplay of the Creator Economy and the Modern World

1:22:15 Creating the World You Want to Live In

1:29:26 Using Art and History to Hone Taste

1:34:00 The Soul-Stirring Work

1:35:40 Where to Find David

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry

X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow

Website: https://nathanbarry.com

Kit: https://www.kit.com

Follow David:

X: https://twitter.com/david_perell

Website: https://www.perell.com

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@DavidPerellChannel

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidperell

Featured in this episode:

Kit: https://www.kit.com

Modern World (YouTube Channel): https://www.youtube.com/@TheModernWorld

Building a Second Brain: https://www.buildingasecondbrain.com

The Artist's Way: https://juliacameronlive.com/books/the-artists-way

Highlights:

01:15 – The obsession with writing as a craft.

20:05 – Understanding and leveraging internet "currents" for content.

40:30 – Why consuming uncorrelated content elevates your work.

59:20 – The art of deep communication in interviewing.

1:29:26 – Cultivating taste by actively discerning what you love and hate.

I recently sat down with my speaking coach, Mike Pacchione, for this totally unprecedented episode where we dissect, minute by minute, my full keynote speech from this year's Craft + Commerce conference. We’re not holding anything back. Mike points out my flaws, celebrates my strengths, and reveals all the chaos that happens backstage that the audience never sees. If you've ever delivered a product launch, feared public speaking, or just want to understand the art of a compelling presentation, you'll learn so much from our candid conversation.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:03 Breaking Down the Keynote
02:22 The Chaos Before the Stage
04:02 The Missing Walk-Out Music
07:44 The "Be a Zero" Concept
09:47 Avoiding Speaker Voice
13:17 Building Tension and Specificity
19:19 The Stephen Colbert Joke
20:52 The Dad's Wisdom Story
28:16 The Challenge of Technical Terms
34:03 Debating Product Announcement Timing
40:35 The Elusive Applause Moment
48:29 Katie's Spotlighting an Audience Member
53:05 The Landing Page Humiliation Slide
01:01:00 The New York City Event Space Announcement
01:07:07 The Closing and Audience Reaction
01:12:00 Rehearsal Techniques and Speaker Notes

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://kit.com

Follow Mike:
Freebie: https://bestspeech.co/nathan
Website: https://bestspeech.co
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mpacchione
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mpacc
X: https://x.com/mpacc

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
John Koenig - The Dictionary of Obscure Sorrows: https://www.youtube.com/user/johnkoenig
The State Change Method - Wes Kao: https://weskao.com
The Happiness Project - Gretchen Rubin: https://gretchenrubin.com/books/the-happiness-project
Tim Urban TED Talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/tim_urban_inside_the_mind_of_a_master_procrastinator
Framer: https://www.framer.com

Highlights:
01:03 – Mike critiques my keynote opening
11:50 – The secret behind my opening pause
25:06 – How real-world stories prove product value
31:09 – The unexpected success of a borrowed joke
53:10 – The power of a critical feedback slide

I've always brought Mike Pacchione in to coach every speaker at my Craft + Commerce conferences, including myself, because he has an uncanny ability to help people transform their talks from good to truly great. Mike's number one goal? For the audience to forget it's even a speech. In our conversation, Mike unpacks his framework for crafting compelling stories, why you should almost never tell them in chronological order, and his genius TED acronym for tension, editing for emotional impact, and the right details. He also shares invaluable insights on designing an ending that resonates and even how to strategically use humor (especially if you're not naturally funny). This episode is packed with lessons I've learned firsthand from Mike over the years.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
02:00 Making the audience forget it's a speech
04:06 Setting the room up for success
06:14 The power of stories in speeches
08:39 Story selection and placement
10:42 Why you don't need to tell stories in order
11:11 Mike's TED acronym for storytelling: Tension
14:55 Editing for emotional impact
20:02 Crafting an engaging middle of a speech
22:57 Asking questions to build tension
24:37 Describing people in vivid detail (loglines)
30:48 Crafting a powerful ending
33:09 The "one more thing" strategy
40:07 Controlling the emotional arc of a talk
40:50 Using humor effectively
44:09 The power of awkward silence and tension
45:53 Cueing the audience for laughs and applause
48:14 Leading the audience with your emotions
50:57 Mike's take on using AI for speeches
55:24 How to work with Mike Pacchione
56:47 Mike's free resource

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://www.kit.com

Follow Mike:
Freebie: https://bestspeech.co/nathan
Website: https://bestspeech.co
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mpacchione
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mpacc
X: https://x.com/mpacc

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
Duarte: https://www.duarte.com
Atomic Habits: https://jamesclear.com/atomic-habits
WP Engine: https://wpengine.com
ConvertKit: https://convertkit.com

Highlights:
02:01 – Getting the audience to forget it's a speech
15:30 – Ending your story in the middle for maximum impact
26:06 – Sarah: The person who eats quinoa for a cheat meal
37:05 – Why you should never end your talk on Q&A
53:02 – The point of a speech is to make an emotional connection

How do you build significant wealth in a way that feels sustainable and joyful, rather than sacrificing your mental and physical health? That's what I explored in my conversation with Mallory Rowan, who achieved a million-dollar net worth by age 29, but not without first hitting a wall of burnout at 22. Her story isn't just about financial metrics; it's a testament to redefining success and building a life where financial freedom supports personal well-being. I was particularly struck by her "Six Solutions Theory" and how she challenges the conventional wisdom about ambition versus balance. Join me as Mallory shares her unique approach to turning profit into compounding assets and creating a business that serves her life, not the other way around.

Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction

01:06 Burnout at 22: Ignoring the whispers

03:59 The toxic cycle of business, health, and happiness

07:22 When you realize the limit keeps moving

10:14 The collision of creativity and finances

13:17 Rebuilding after burnout

18:03 The difference between revenue and profit

21:02 Making investing goals exciting

27:26 Getting specific about building wealth

30:45 The cottage purchase and creative financing

32:02 Active income and first down payment

34:03 The million dollars invested goal

41:17 Why net worth goals matter more

52:27 Having it all: Ambition and avoiding burnout

55:28 Why behind the goal: The Toddler Test

57:38 The categories: non-negotiables, nice-to-haves, experiments

01:00:04 How a nest egg enables lighter living and creativity

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry

X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow

Website: https://nathanbarry.com

Kit: https://www.kit.com

Follow Mallory:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/malloryrowan

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@theinbetweenersco

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@malloryrowan

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/malloryrowan?originalSubdomain=ca

Website: https://malloryrowan.com

Featured in this episode:

Kit: https://www.kit.com

Highlights:

01:06 – Ignoring the whispers before burnout screams

15:00 – Strategically building "boredom" into your business model

25:21 – The "Thumbnailing" approach to problem-solving

41:17 – Why net worth goals offer true financial freedom

01:00:04 – How a solid nest egg allows for lighter, more playful business decisions

How do actually make meaningful money on Instagram? That's what I wanted to find out when I sat down with Gannon Meyer. He's figured out how to turn social media attention into actual revenue. My guest today, Gannon, went from living with his girlfriend's mom to building a thriving business in just 12 months, and he credits a huge part of that transformation to what he shares in our conversation. We dive deep into his "free, segment, upsell" framework for converting Instagram followers into paying customers, and I even get a direct critique of my own content strategy. If you're looking to monetize your audience on Instagram, you won't want to miss Gannon's insights.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
01:14 Converting Instagram attention into revenue
03:33 Client examples and creator income levels
06:47 The "Free, Segment, Upsell" funnel framework
08:39 Using open-ended questions for better segmentation
10:50 How ManyChat and AI interpret responses
13:12 Real-world example: Adrian's camera business
15:52 Good vs. bad open-ended questions
18:18 Crafting a CTA for your free content
22:00 Storytelling frameworks for strong retention
30:07 Maximizing engagement with Instagram Stories
33:22 The impact of CTAs on Instagram reach
35:01 Why comments are crucial for discoverability
44:19 The truth about views vs. revenue
47:55 Deep diving into solving problems for revenue
51:08 How Gannon's 'whiteboard' videos attract clients
53:22 Gannon's life transformation in 12 months
58:50 The realization: being willing to be wrong in public
1:04:15 The power of putting yourself out there

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://www.kit.com

Follow Gannon:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/gannon.meyer
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@gannonmeyer
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gannonmeyer

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com

Highlights:
01:30 Gannon's approach to helping people sell their products
16:17 How to ask open-ended questions effectively
30:57 The PSA story framework for Instagram
46:12 Why high views don't always equal high revenue
59:57 The power of being willing to be wrong in public

Why did this founder fire himself from his own company? That's what I wanted to find out when I sat down with Steve Kamb, founder of Nerd Fitness. We've known each other for a long time, and I've watched him build an incredible audience and business. But then, to my surprise, he "fired" himself – twice! Steve shares the surprising truth about chasing growth, the pitfalls of wearing the wrong hat in your own business, and how he rediscovered his passion for writing. His journey is a powerful reminder that sometimes, the true path to fulfillment means stepping away from the very thing you've so diligently built.

Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction

01:10 Firing myself (twice!) from Nerd Fitness

05:37 The five years I spent in the wrong seat

07:20 The "If you're not growing, you're shrinking" myth

10:37 How I realized writing is what lights me up

12:55 When to double down on strengths vs. fix weaknesses

18:19 The curated "all I do is win" internet vs. real life

20:20 Sharing my failures: cancer, Google changing, divorce

23:09 The overwhelming positive response to vulnerability

24:06 How my book was born and evolved

30:17 My visit to the Museum of Failure

33:55 My PACT framework: Pause, Accept, Change, Try

40:22 Everything old is new again in content

49:00 The value of Craft + Commerce and community

56:14 Longevity in creative work: falling in love with the craft

1:02:43 How to Try Again: Where to find the book

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry

X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow

Website: https://nathanbarry.com

Kit: https://www.kit.com

Follow Steve:

How To Try Again (Book): https://howtotryagain.com

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/stevekamb

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevekamb

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/stevekamb

X: https://x.com/SteveKamb

Nerd Fitness: https://www.nerdfitness.com

Featured in this episode:

Kit: https://www.kit.com

How to Try Again: https://howtotryagain.com

Nerd Fitness: https://www.nerdfitness.com

The Museum of Failure: https://failuremuseum.com

Codifying your knowledge into intellectual property (IP) is a crucial step for scaling any business, but what my guest Mo Bunnell shared in this episode completely changed my perspective on how to do it and the incredible impact it can have. Mo, author of Give to Grow and founder of the Bundle Idea Group, has built an astonishing career training professionals at some of the world's most prestigious organizations. He walked me through the evolution of his IP, from humble beginnings to the sophisticated materials he uses today to secure multi-six-figure contracts. This isn't something he typically breaks down publicly, and I was genuinely surprised by the tangible examples and actionable steps he provided for transforming a service-based business into an IP-driven powerhouse.

Timestamps:

00:00 Introduction

02:29 Codifying your system in a weekend

05:07 From intuition to framework: creating IP

08:00 The evolution of training materials

11:20 Essential elements of effective IP

18:30 The economics of B2B and corporate clients

21:00 How to get your first pilot clients

26:00 Overcoming B2B objections

29:00 Translating B2C IP to B2B corporate world

31:00 Identifying high-leverage industries and roles

34:00 Lowering the bar on perfection for B2B

37:00 Lead magnets for decision-makers vs. users

41:40 Advanced lead magnet strategies

45:20 The power of public workshops

49:40 Scaling beyond yourself: travel and certification

52:45 Michael Hyatt's Business Accelerator growth

56:00 The annuity effect of corporate training

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry

X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow

Website: https://nathanbarry.com

Kit: https://www.kit.com

Follow Mo:

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mobunnell

Bunnell Idea Group: https://bunnellideagroup.com

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd0dvX8kfxF_MMz6IZT17kw

Give to Grow: https://bunnellideagroup.com/givetogrow

Featured in this episode:

Kit: https://www.kit.com

The Snowball System: How to Win More Business and Turn Customers into Raving Fans: https://www.amazon.com/Snowball-System-Business-Customers-Raving/dp/1640950343

Unreasonable Hospitality: https://www.amazon.com/Unreasonable-Hospitality-Remarkable-Giving-People/dp/0593418193

Highlights:

01:04 – How Mo started codifying his IP

04:08 – The power of IP to scale a business

11:22 – Four components of world-class IP

18:49 – The "this changes everything" B2B opportunity

37:04 – Lead magnets for buyers versus users

43:09 – James Clear's strategic review request

56:00 – The annuity model of B2B corporate training

I’ve always been fascinated by how some companies manage to create not just customers, but passionate communities who become true advocates. My guest today, Russell Brunson, has mastered this, building ClickFunnels to a staggering 100,000+ users *without any outside funding*. In our conversation, Russell broke down the exact framework he used to achieve this, a framework born from studying thousands of successful movements across history, politics, and even religion. If you've ever wondered how to inspire loyalty that goes beyond a simple transaction and transforms your audience into a committed tribe, this episode reveals the secrets to building a movement, not just a business.

Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction
02:16 Studying Successful Movements
03:30 From Educator to Movement Leader
04:58 The Three Core Elements of a Movement
06:25 The Attractive Character (The Guide)
07:05 The New Opportunity (Not Just an Improvement)
09:24 The Future-Based Cause
12:12 Universal Principles in Movements
13:17 The Power of Positioning
18:47 Crafting the New Opportunity
27:12 The Importance of Customer Alignment
28:16 Cutting Through the Noise with Your Message
33:23 The Power of Customer Stories
35:12 Why General Messaging Can Be More Powerful
46:17 Milestones and Awards for Motivation
50:50 Creating Belief and Encouraging Progress
52:33 Scaling with Progressive Achievement
59:55 Where to Learn More from Russell Brunson

If you enjoyed this episode, please like and subscribe, share it with your friends, and leave a review. I read every single one.

Learn more about the podcast: https://nathanbarry.com/show

Follow Nathan:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nathanbarry
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathanbarry
X: https://twitter.com/nathanbarry
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thenathanbarryshow
Website: https://nathanbarry.com
Kit: https://www.kit.com

Follow Russell:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/russellbrunson
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC2qUDKqTsz00csykCYgdLuA
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/russellbrunson
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/russbrunson
X: https://x.com/russellbrunson
Website: https://russellbrunson.com

Featured in this episode:
Kit: https://www.kit.com
Expert Secrets: https://expertsecrets.com
ClickFunnels: https://www.clickfunnels.com

Highlights:
06:09 – Every Movement Needs a Guide
11:00 – The Power of a Future-Based Cause
24:50 – The Importance of Actively Choosing Your Dream Customer
47:50 – The Two Comma Club: Gamifying Entrepreneurial Success
57:20 – Why People Care More About a Plaque Than Money