Whether you agree or disagree, there’s a lot to unpack and discuss about your rights—and the realities—during a traffic stop. Let’s get into it.

I sit down with law student Troy Hendrickson to tackle a question I’ve noticed popping up everywhere on social media: Do you really have to get out of your car when the police tell you to? After watching numerous viral videos of people refusing officers’ orders during traffic stops, I decided it was time to demystify the legal history behind this scenario—especially the Supreme Court case Pennsylvania v. Mimms.

I explain why, yes, you do have to follow police instructions in these situations (even if you disagree), and why the courtroom—not the side of the road—is where you should fight any questionable police conduct. Along the way, Troy and I explore the wider issues: officer safety, misunderstandings about the law, and the rise of misinformation online.

Here are 3 key takeaways you should know:

• You must comply if ordered out of your vehicle. Thanks to the Supreme Court decision in Pennsylvania v. Mims (1977), police can lawfully order you out of your car during a stop, even for minor violations.
• The fight happens in court—not on the roadside. Challenging a police order (even if you think it’s unfair or unlawful) on the street will result in arrest or worse. “You’re going to lose that fight…and a window.”
• Understanding why is crucial. These rules are based on “officer safety” and the structure of the rule of law. If you think your rights were violated, work with an attorney after the fact.

Submit your questions to www.lawyertalkpodcast.com.

Recorded at Channel 511.

Stephen E. Palmer, Esq. has been practicing criminal defense almost exclusively since 1995. He has represented people in federal, state, and local courts in Ohio and elsewhere.

Though he focuses on all areas of criminal defense, he particularly enjoys complex cases in state and federal courts.

He has unique experience handling and assembling top defense teams of attorneys and experts in cases involving allegations of child abuse (false sexual allegations, false physical abuse allegations), complex scientific cases involving allegations of DUI and vehicular homicide cases with blood alcohol tests, and any other criminal cases that demand jury trial experience.

Steve has unique experience handling numerous high publicity cases that have garnered national attention.

For more information about Steve and his law firm, visit Palmer Legal Defense.

Copyright 2025 Stephen E. Palmer - Attorney At Law

Mentioned in this episode:

Circle 270 Media Podcast Consultants

Circle 270 Media® is a podcast consulting firm based in Columbus, Ohio, specializing in helping businesses develop, launch, and optimize podcasts as part of their marketing strategy. The firm emphasizes the importance of storytelling through podcasting to differentiate businesses and engage with their audiences effectively. www.circle270media.com

If you’ve ever wondered whether just carrying a large sum of cash could land you in legal hot water—or what steps you can take if it happens to you—this episode is a must-listen.

Host Steve Palmer is joined by Troy Hendrickson, a law student, to tackle the not-so-theoretical question: What really happens if the police take your cash during a routine traffic stop?

Steve and Troy unravel the complexities behind asset forfeiture, sharing real-life cases where drivers have had tens of thousands of dollars seized by law enforcement—sometimes with little explanation or due process. Together, discuss the legal procedures that should protect your property rights, what “due process” really means in these situations, and how a legal team actually fights to recover seized money.

They also dig into the difference between criminal charges and civil asset forfeiture, dispel myths about what cash in your car “proves,” and highlight the burdens of proof on both sides. Plus, they candidly share the frustrations and realities of navigating police departments, public records, and the sometimes slow-moving wheels of justice.

Moments

00:00 "Due Process and Contraband Notices"

03:57 Criminal Indictment and Asset Forfeiture

07:01 "Seeking Legal Help"

09:48 "Money Laundering Charges Negotiation"

13:58 Drug Mule Traffic Stop Explained

17:13 Money Possession Isn't Criminal

22:54 Roadside Bribe in Costa Rica

Here are 3 key takeaways you should know:

• Due Process Should Prevail (But Doesn’t Always): The system is supposed to require official notice and a chance to fight for your seized property. But real-world cases often leave people in limbo, unable to get a straight answer or their assets back without taking legal action.
• Just Having Cash Is Not a Crime: Simply possessing large sums of money—even if it sets off police suspicions—is not illegal. The government needs something more than "it looks fishy" or "a dog sniffed it" to justify permanent seizure.
• Challenging Seizure Is Complicated and Costly: To recover seized money, you often have to initiate a civil lawsuit, shouldering the burden to prove it's your property and that the government is holding it. This process can be lengthy, expensive, and stacked against innocent owners.

Submit your questions to www.lawyertalkpodcast.com.

Recorded at Channel 511.

Stephen E. Palmer, Esq. has been practicing criminal defense almost exclusively since 1995. He has represented people in federal, state, and local courts in Ohio and elsewhere.

Though he focuses on all areas of criminal defense, he particularly enjoys complex cases in state and federal courts.

He has unique experience handling and assembling top defense teams of attorneys and experts in cases involving allegations of child abuse (false sexual allegations, false physical abuse allegations), complex scientific cases involving allegations of DUI and vehicular homicide cases with blood alcohol tests, and any other criminal cases that demand jury trial experience.

Steve has unique experience handling numerous high publicity cases that have garnered national attention.

For more information about Steve and his law firm, visit Palmer Legal Defense.

Copyright 2025 Stephen E. Palmer - Attorney At Law

Mentioned in this episode:

Circle 270 Media Podcast Consultants

Circle 270 Media® is a podcast...

If you’re curious about the machinery of high-stakes criminal trials, want to understand the strategy behind post-conviction moves, or just love hearing behind-the-scenes details from seasoned legal minds, this episode’s for you.

Welcome back to Lawyer Talk, where legal education meets real-world controversy! In this episode, host Steve Palmer teams up with law student Troy Hendrickson for a special "law school edition" focused on the high-profile P Diddy trial. The guys dig into the nitty gritty of what happens between conviction and sentencing, breaking down the so-called “throwaway” post-trial motions and whether they ever actually work.

From LeBron James’ famous party quote to the real implications of a compromise verdict, Steve and Troy peel back the layers of legal strategy used in Diddy’s defense—discussing grand juries, jury instructions, and the difference between a good argument and a long shot. They also cover why lawyers sometimes file motions more for publicity than for results, and what kind of jail time credit Diddy might expect after almost two years behind bars.

Moments

00:00 "Strategic 'Throwaway' Court Motions"

04:42 "Trial Objections and Appeals"

06:47 "Always Object in Court"

10:14 "Grand Jury's Role Examined"

14:50 "Prosecutorial Misconduct Claim Raised"

16:54 Sentencing Guidelines and Considerations

19:39 "Struggling for Connection"

3 Key Takeaways:

Post-Trial Motions Matter (But Aren’t Magic Bullets):

Defense attorneys often file motions for a new trial between conviction and sentencing. While many see these as “throwaway” or strategic filings, sometimes they’re essential for preserving arguments or highlighting egregious errors like jury misconduct.

Grand Jury Isn’t Always a Shield:

The episode highlights how the grand jury process, intended as a safeguard against baseless charges, is often procedural rather than protective. Prosecutors nearly always get indictments—even with flimsy evidence—making it challenging for defendants facing stacked charges.

Publicity & Sentencing Strategy:

High-profile cases come with unique challenges. Lawyers might file post-conviction motions not just for legal reasons, but also to shape public perception. Additionally, sentencing memoranda and jail-time credit play big roles in the ultimate outcome, sometimes overlooked in law school teachings.

Submit your questions to www.lawyertalkpodcast.com.

Recorded at Channel 511.

Stephen E. Palmer, Esq. has been practicing criminal defense almost exclusively since 1995. He has represented people in federal, state, and local courts in Ohio and elsewhere.

Though he focuses on all areas of criminal defense, he particularly enjoys complex cases in state and federal courts.

He has unique experience handling and assembling top defense teams of attorneys and experts in cases involving allegations of child abuse (false sexual allegations, false physical abuse allegations), complex scientific cases involving allegations of DUI and vehicular homicide cases with blood alcohol tests, and any other criminal cases that demand jury trial experience.

Steve has unique experience handling numerous high publicity cases that have garnered national attention.

For more information about Steve and his law firm, visit Palmer Legal Defense.

Copyright 2025 Stephen E. Palmer - Attorney At Law