The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player!

Overview
In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg unpack the lawsuit Compass filed against Zillow over its ZLAS (Zillow Listing Agreement Standard) policy. They debate the strength of Compass’s legal claims, the language cited in the complaint, and what the alleged behind-the-scenes meetings reveal about Zillow’s influence in the real estate industry. Rob argues that Zillow is exercising monopoly power—even if it’s not illegal—while Greg pushes back on whether that power is absolute or harmful.

Key Takeaways

• Compass Lawsuit Against Zillow – Compass has sued Zillow over ZLAS, and Rob and Greg break down what the complaint says, especially around alleged comments from Zillow executives.

• Redfin’s Role in the Lawsuit – The lawsuit describes a phone call between Redfin CEO Glenn Kelman and Compass’s Robert Reffkin, which raises questions about Redfin’s alignment or neutrality.

• Allegations from the Zillow Meeting – The complaint claims Zillow executives said they would “not allow” Compass to have listings that aren’t on Zillow. Rob questions how MLSs will interpret that language.

• Zillow’s Relationship to MLSs – Rob and Greg debate whether Zillow is stepping into a policy-making role that could create long-term tension with MLSs.

• Monopoly vs. Illegal Monopoly – Rob insists Zillow is a monopoly in terms of influence, while Greg questions whether that matters if they haven’t broken any laws.

• Private Listing Networks as Leverage – Rob suggests that large brokerages should consider creating private listing networks to provoke offers or concessions from Zillow.

• MLS and NAR Dynamics – The conversation revisits the lack of MLS policy leadership from NAR and whether groups like CMLS can step up in its place.

• Consumer Perception of Real Estate – Greg ends by cautioning that all this infighting could be harmful to public trust, as evidenced by critical reader comments in mainstream news outlets.

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website

Greg’s Website

Watch us on YouTube

Our Sponsors:

Cotality

Notorious VIP

The Giant Steps Job Board

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

The Industry Relations Podcast is now available on your favorite podcast player!

Overview
In this special episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg take a break from real estate to talk about one of their shared passions: music. They explore the most transformative artists and bands across genres from the 70s through today. Their conversation dives deep into the cultural impact of acts like Nirvana, Depeche Mode, NWA, and Metallica, and whether artists like Kanye West, Jay-Z, or Eminem changed the landscape or simply excelled within it.

Key Takeaways

• What Makes an Artist Transformative – Rob and Greg define “transformative” as artists who changed culture or shifted their genre’s direction.

• Rock, Pop, and Hair Metal – From The Police and Joy Division to Motley Crue and Metallica, they debate which bands truly left a mark.

• New Wave and Synth Pop – A back-and-forth on whether bands like Depeche Mode, Erasure, and Eurythmics defined the New Wave era.

• The Rise of Hip-Hop – Analysis of Public Enemy, NWA, and Biggie’s role in changing rap’s tone—from political to gangsta to materialistic.

• Female Singers and Torch Artists – Greg shares his appreciation for female vocalists, from Tori Amos and Natalie Merchant to Billie Holiday and Aretha Franklin.

• Jazz, EDM, and Modern Music – A look at how genres like jazz and electronica evolved—and why Rob thinks music hasn’t really changed since the 2000s.

• Cultural Identity and Music in High School – Reflections on how music once defined high school social groups and why today’s digital world may be missing that connection.

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website

Greg’s Website

Watch us on YouTube

Our Sponsors:

Cotality

Notorious VIP

The Giant Steps Job Board

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg reflect on a recent panel discussion hosted by the Orange County Association of REALTORS®. They discuss the incentives that drive agent and broker behavior, the value and vulnerabilities of the MLS in a post-settlement world, and the broader structural changes facing the real estate industry. The first half of the conversation also includes a candid exchange on trades as a career path and the shifting economic landscape for young adults.

Key Takeaways

• MLS Incentive Structures – A deep dive into how policy changes have affected the incentive for brokers to remain in the MLS, especially with the decline of enforceable compensation.

• Broker Power and Consolidation – Why the largest brokerages may now have more incentive to operate independently of the MLS and what that means for smaller firms.

• Agent-Level Impact – Rob and Greg question whether large-scale policy debates truly affect everyday agents and argue that most industry drama doesn’t change the work agents do.

• Panel Highlights – Reflections on a live panel with James Dwiggins and Ed Zorn, including audience reactions and a question: “What would you do if you ran NAR?”

• Compensation and Enforcement Post-Settlement – Analysis of how buyer-agent compensation continues through informal agreements and social norms, despite changes to MLS rules.

• Trades and Career Advice – A wide-ranging discussion on whether young people should consider skilled trades as an alternative to traditional college paths.

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website

Greg’s Website

Watch us on YouTube!

Our Sponsors:

Cotality

Notorious VIP

The Giant Steps Job Board

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg recap the 2025 NAR Midyear Meetings in Washington, D.C., discussing key industry developments, MLS policy changes, and behind-the-scenes dynamics. Topics include the repeal of the commingling ban, updates to NAR’s controversial 10-5 speech policy, and ongoing MLS consolidation. They also cover vendor presence, association politics, and speculation around leadership changes in CMLS.

Key Takeaways

• Compass “Protest” at Midyear – Greg recounts organizing a publicity stunt in front of Compass’s hotel to promote Tuesday.com

• Repeal of Co-mingling Ban – Discussion on how NAR’s removal of the commingling restriction could impact listing syndication and MLS relevance.

• 10-5 Policy Changes – Rob and Greg unpack the revision of NAR’s hate speech rule, its political implications, and the proposal for a “conduct unbecoming” clause.

• MLS Consolidation – A growing theme from the meetings was consolidation, with T3 data showing Bright MLS now leading in subscriber count.

• CMLS Leadership Transition – With Denee Evans stepping down, the episode explores possible successors and whether CMLS and RESO should consider a merger.

• Policy Governance Shifts – Signs point to NAR possibly stepping back from MLS policy-making, sparking conversation about which organization might take that role.

• Vendor and Trade Show Insights – Observations about reduced vendor presence and the challenges for newer tech companies trying to break into the space.

• Affordability and Market Outlook – Brief discussion on macro issues like tariffs, political shifts, and whether the real estate market is moving toward a buyer’s market.

LInks

Rally for the MLS (video)

ZillowGate Van

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Watch us on YouTube

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg run a thought experiment: What if we’re entering a true buyer’s market? They walk through ten major industry topics—from antitrust litigation to portals, AI, and MLS relevance—and analyze how each might shift if buyers suddenly gained the upper hand. Along the way, they debate policy, technology, and market psychology, drawing connections between historical trends and current market signals.

Watch us on YouTube!

Links

The U.S. Housing Market Has Nearly 500,000 More Sellers Than Buyers—the Most on Record. That Will Likely Cause Home Prices to Fall

Key Takeaways

• Antitrust & Legal Landscape – Discussion of how a buyer’s market might (or might not) affect current and future antitrust lawsuits in real estate.

• Government Regulation – Exploration of potential political reactions, including pressure on corporate landlords, affordability policy, or even renewed interest in rent control.

• Tech-Enabled Brokerages – Examination of whether brokerages like Redfin, Compass, and eXp gain or lose advantage when the market shifts toward buyers.

• iBuyers & Institutional Activity – Rob and Greg assess whether a buyer’s market helps or hurts companies like Opendoor and investor-focused strategies.

• Portals & Exclusive Inventory – Deep dive into how platforms like Zillow and Homes.com may adapt, and whether exclusive listings could gain ground.

• AI & Automation – Consideration of how AI could enable cheaper, more scalable buyer representation services—and who might benefit.

• Consumer Trust – Debate over whether a buyer’s market could rebuild trust in the industry or simply reduce agent count, leaving higher-quality professionals.

• DIY Real Estate – Why self-service homebuying remains unlikely to surge, even with market power shifting toward buyers.

• Industry Consolidation – Prediction that competitive pressure could drive further brokerage and vendor consolidation.

• MLS & Association Relevance – Analysis of whether MLSs become more or less important in a buyer’s market, especially in the context of exclusives and policy enforcement.

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg analyze Zillow’s recently released ZLAS policy language and debate whether it reflects a shift in Zillow’s priorities. They discuss the implications of allowing broker direct feeds, the enforcement challenges around delayed marketing, and whether Zillow’s current stance can still be considered “consumer first.” The conversation also explores how MLSs and major brokerages are interpreting ZLAS and how this policy intersects with Clear Cooperation rules and VOW/IDX frameworks.

Watch us on YouTube!

Links

Howard Hanna in open rebellion against Clear Cooperation Policy - https://www.inman.com/2025/05/23/howard-hanna-in-open-rebellion-against-clear-cooperation-policy/

Zillow's ZLAS: Make Zillow Great Again - https://substack.com/home/post/p-164029933

Hoby Hanna don't like the rules - https://www.vendoralley.com/2025/05/27/hoby-hanna-dont-like-the-rules/

Key Takeaways

• Zillow’s ZLAS Policy Language – The official policy now allows listings to be submitted via MLS or broker syndication feeds, raising questions about enforcement and intent.

• Broker Compliance and Enforcement – Rob and Greg explore whether Zillow has the capacity or systems in place to enforce ZLAS, and how it compares to MLS-style rule enforcement.

• Direct Broker Feeds as a Loophole – The inclusion of broker syndication feeds in the policy language could enable firms like Compass to bypass ZLAS restrictions.

• VOW vs. IDX Access – Discussion on how Zillow’s VOW-powered listing visibility may conflict with its public consumer-first messaging.

• Local MLS Rule Conflicts – ZLAS policy explicitly overrides local MLS or state-level rules that allow extended delayed marketing, creating potential legal and operational conflicts.

• Marketplace Power Shift – Zillow’s self-enforced policy is viewed as a signal of its growing authority in the real estate ecosystem, independent of MLS governance.
  
  

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg explore the idea of the elusive “end-to-end platform” in real estate. Prompted by Lower’s acquisition of Movoto, they revisit decades of efforts by portals and brokerages to deliver a seamless transaction experience—from search to closing. They examine why this model has struggled to take hold in residential real estate, compare it to consumer experiences like Amazon and Tesla, and consider whether the real estate agent has always been the true end-to-end solution.

Key Takeaways

• Lower Acquires Movoto – Discussion of the strategic rationale behind a mortgage company acquiring a real estate portal.

• Why End-to-End Platforms Struggle – Analysis of why Zillow, Redfin, and others have failed to deliver a fully integrated homebuying experience.

• The Agent as Platform – Debate over whether real estate agents already fulfill the role of a true end-to-end solution for consumers.

• Lessons from Other Industries – Examples from Amazon, Tesla, and travel that highlight the differences in consumer expectations and loyalty.

• Professional End-to-End Platforms – Exploration of whether a consolidated platform for agents—covering lead gen through payment—could be built, and what it would require.

• Tech Stack Attempts – Review of efforts by companies like Lone Wolf, Inside Real Estate, and MoxiWorks to build comprehensive agent-facing platforms.

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg examine CoStar’s recent announcement that Homes.com will boost listings banned on Zillow. They discuss whether this strategy is aimed at consumers or brokers, and whether it signals a broader battle for power in the real estate portal space. They also explore the potential implications of a proposed Illinois bill that would require public listing access by law, and debate what government involvement could mean for MLSs, agents, and listing distribution.

Watch us on YouTube!

Links:

Homes.com will 'boost' listings that are banned on Zillow: Florance

Don't Bring a Knife to a Gun Fight

Key Takeaways

• Homes.com vs. Zillow – Discussion of CoStar’s strategy to position Homes.com as a portal that accepts listings excluded by Zillow and what it means for brokers.

• Do Consumers Use Multiple Portals? – Rob explores whether buyers actually use more than one or two listing sites, and what that means for listing visibility.

• Government Involvement in Listing Policy – Analysis of an Illinois bill proposing mandatory public access for listings and the role of Zillow and NAHREP in backing it.

• Public Utility Debate for MLSs – Exploration of whether MLSs could be redefined as public utilities under new regulations.

• Housing Affordability and Political Risks – Rob and Greg discuss how affordability pressures and political narratives could shift public perception of agents, landlords, and listing control.

• Shifting to a Buyer’s Market – Discussion of early signs that certain areas are flipping to buyer-favorable conditions and how that could affect pocket listings and strategy.

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios