In Marcus' final episode as co-host of In the Meanwhile, he and Nora turn the microphones on each other to ask what this strange, joyful experiment has taught them about surviving a slow-motion apocalypse. They reflect on the conversations that changed them, the power of community, the everyday work of making change, and why joy is something worth collecting even in the bleakest times. It's a bittersweet farewell, a love letter to the people who carried the show, and a reminder that whatever comes next, we survive the meanwhile together.

Mentioned in the episode:

Marcus is leaving journalism, but he'll never stop fighting for the south end | More about Marcus | Ad Astra | Ella Baker: Strong people don't need strong leaders | Camp Laurel's final Family Camp |

Related Episodes:

Minneapolis Solidarity | Father Ray Riding | Peter Beinart | Loretta J. Ross | Ijeoma Oluo | Dean Spade (2025) | Dean Spade (2026) | Sen. Chris Murphy | Sen. Pramila Jayapal | Warm Cookies of the Revolution | Mark Paschal | The Impossible will Take a little while |

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

Follow us:

Instagram | BlueSky | Website

Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

Across the country, everyday people are fighting some of the most powerful AI companies on earth — and winning. But the untold story of data center resistance is that it's not just tech-NIMBYism, but a civil rights and environmental justice fight led by Black and Brown communities. This week, Nora (flying solo while Marcus is out) sits down with Abre' Connor, Director of the Center for Environmental and Climate Justice at the NAACP, to talk about the fast-growing movement against AI data centers. They dig into why this fight is following a painfully familiar playbook of environmental racism, what it took to sue Elon Musk's xAI over unpermitted gas turbines in Southaven, Mississippi, and what Gary, Indiana's weeks-long power outage really tells us about who bears the cost of the AI boom. It's a conversation about what's possible when communities refuse to be told they're disposable — and build the power to prove it.

Mentioned in the episode:

Robert Reich Explainer on Data Centers | AOC presses EPA administrator on water and data centers | PBS Overview on Data Centers | US Data Center Moratorium Tracker | Trump: Communities that reject data centers will end up 'backwards and poor' | Data Centers could be the winning issue for democrats | NAACP | How the NAACP Is Stopping Dirty Data | Earthjustice | Gary Indiana power failures | east coast data center accused of violating federal law

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

Follow us:

Instagram | BlueSky | Website

Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.

Today, In the Meanwhile is taking a much-needed breather and sharing the final three episodes of Facing It with Dr. Jennifer Atkinson, a podcast about climate grief, eco-anxiety, and the deeply inconvenient reality of being a human being on a planet in crisis. Because knowing the world is on fire doesn't automatically tell us how to live in it. How do we face grief without surrendering to despair? How do we stay engaged without burning ourselves out? And how might actually feeling the enormity of what we're losing become the first step toward fighting for what remains?

Mentioned in the episode:

Facing It | The Existential Toolkit for the Climate Crisis: How to Teach in a Burning World | Gardenland: Nature, Fantasy and Everyday Practice

Support the pod:

Donate here to support In The Meanwhile

Follow us:

Instagram | BlueSky | Website

Read Nora and Marcus's Books:

Crowded Out: The True Costs of Crowdfunding Healthcare | Readying to Rise

Music: No Tears for a Wolf · Ahamefule J. Oluo · Okanomodé. Used with permission.

Logo by Nikki Barron.

Transcripts are machine-generated and imperfect.

Nora and Marcus's work on the podcast is separate from their professional roles and does not represent the views of their employers.

Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links.