How Songs Make Money is a podcast series about music rights and the income streams associated with songwriting and composition, hosted by Dr Ellis Jones, Lecturer in Music and Management at the University of Leeds.

This week's episode offers an interview with Toby Huelin (University of Leeds) and Júlia Durand (NOVA University of Lisbon), who have both individually and collaboratively published academic research on the subject of library music (also known as production music). In our interview, Julia and Toby provide an overview of library music and its history, before moving on to consider some of the key developments in the library music industry in this century – including the platformisation of library music and the encroachment of A.I. technologies.

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Glossary

Buy-out model – in this context, a business model in which a library music company pays an up-front fee in exchange for long-term ownership of compositional and/or performance rights

Scoring to picture – composing music for a specific media synchronisation (which library music differs from insofar as it is not composed for a specific use, but for a range of potential uses).

Underscore – in this context, a variation of the musical score with dominant melodic themes removed.

Cues – in this context, sections of musical material that might be ‘dropped in’ to various points of the media to align with on-screen developments.

Reference track – in this context, a musical recording or composition that media producers provide to composers as a means to direct towards the desired style and tone.

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References and further reading

Deaville, J., Durand, J., Huelin, T., & Morton, M. (2024). Library Music in Digital Media. Music, Sound, and the Moving Image, 18(2), 95-113.

Durand, J. (2020). ‘Romantic Piano’and ‘Sleazy Saxophone’ Categories and Stereotypes in Library Music Catalogues. Music, Sound, and the Moving Image, 14(1), 23-45.

Durand, J., & Huelin, T. (2024). ‘Another conspiracy about a royalty-free song’: Library music in contemporary political discourse. Media, Culture & Society, 46(8), 1541-1558.

Huelin, T. M. (2022). Library music and its use in contemporary British television production (Doctoral dissertation, University of Leeds).

Johnston, N., Roy, E., Sexton, J. (2025) Anonymous Sounds : Library Music and Screen Cultures in the 1960s and 1970s. Bloomsbury.

Roy, E. A. (2023). Under suspicion: library music and the Musicians’ Union in Britain, 1960–1978. Popular Music, 42(1), 1-19.

Audio excerpts

‘Light and Tuneful’ (Mansfield). Performed by KPM Recorded Music Library. Available on the album Life is For Living: Impact Themes for Titles and Montages [KPM1110]. ℗ 1972 KPM Music. © 2009 KPM Music Ltd. Used for purposes of criticism and review under the ‘fair dealing’ exception of UK Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988.

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All views expressed on this podcast are those of the speakers, and do not necessarily represent the views of the University of Leeds, the School of Music, or any other organisation. Nothing in this podcast should be interpreted as business or legal advice.

How Songs Make Money is created and assembled by Ellis Jones, with contributions from students on the University of Leeds, Music Management MA course. This series is edited by Nikolai Klimanski. Our theme music is also written and produced by Nik Klimanski, and is included with permission. This series of How Songs Make Money is supported by ‘Research Boost’ funding from the Leeds Arts and Humanities Research Institute, and enabled by Digital Education Service’s Podcasting Pilot. Special thanks to Sam Wyman for their support, as well as to Angela Hulme, Mia Windsor, Liev Cherry, and Michelle Schneider.

How Songs Make Money is a podcast series about music rights and the income streams associated with songwriting and composition, hosted by Dr Ellis Jones, Lecturer in Music and Management at the University of Leeds.

This week's episode is produced by El Kirkwood, a recent graduate of our Music Management MA course. El explores the world of sync licensing, reflecting on the economic value of sync deals, the question of how much ‘exposure’ through sync placements is really worth, and the challenges facing smaller independent artists in securing rewarding placements. The episode draws on an interview with Danny West, who at the time was working for a Leeds-based music organisation called Come Play With Me. This episode was recorded in April 2024, and since then Danny has moved to a new role as Producer at Universal Production Music UK.

El is also the creator of b!tch zine, and bassist in the Leeds-based punk band Helle. You can find out more about those projects here:

https://www.instagram.com/bitchzine/?hl=en

https://www.instagram.com/hellebandofficial/?hl=en

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All views expressed on this podcast are those of the speakers, and do not necessarily represent the views of the University of Leeds, the School of Music, or any other organisation. Nothing in this podcast should be interpreted as business or legal advice.

How Songs Make Money is created and assembled by Ellis Jones, with contributions from students on the University of Leeds, Music Management MA course. This series is edited by Nikolai Klimanski. Our theme music is also written and produced by Nik Klimanski, and is included with permission. This series of How Songs Make Money is supported by ‘Research Boost’ funding from the Leeds Arts and Humanities Research Institute, and enabled by Digital Education Service’s Podcasting Pilot. Special thanks to Sam Wyman for their support, as well as to Angela Hulme, Mia Windsor, Liev Cherry, and Michelle Schneider.

How Songs Make Money is a podcast series about music rights and the income streams associated with songwriting and composition, hosted by Dr Ellis Jones, Lecturer in Music and Management at the University of Leeds.

This week's episode offers an interview with William Castile, who is currently International Music Rights Manager at Phoenix Music International. In our interview, Will helped me to understand the operations of Phoenix Music, and the character of the music rights they oversee, as well as his day-to-day role in handling music rights across digital platforms. We also discussed the challenges of working with catalogue recordings, and how to keep both artists and labels in the limelight – including through digital platforms as well as more traditional media campaigns.

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Glossary

CMS (Content Management System) – An application enabling users to create, manage, and modify digital content and metadata, generally without requiring extensive technical knowledge or programming skills.

CMO (Collective Management Organisation) – An organisation responsible for licensing and tracking music rights, and distributing royalties to rightsholders.

Gramex – A Danish neighbouring rights collection society. Essentially the equivalent to the UK’s PPL in that territory.

PPL – A UK collective management organisation handling the rights of performers and recording rightsholders specifically (rather than publishing rights pertaining to musical compositions).

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References and further reading

Brøvig, R. (2023). Parody in the age of remix: mashup creativity vs. the takedown. MIT Press.

Brøvig-Hanssen, R., & Jones, E. (2023). Remix’s retreat? Content moderation, copyright law and mashup music. new media & society, 25(6), 1271-1289.

Cross, A. ‘Here’s a running list of artists who have sold some or all of their song catalogues to a new breed of company. (Updated as required)’. A Journal of Musical Things, Sep 9 2025. Available: https://www.ajournalofmusicalthings.com/heres-a-running-list-of-artists-who-have-sold-some-or-all-of-their-song-catalogues-to-a-new-breed-of-company/

Hill, S. (2022). One-Hit Wonders: An Oblique History of Popular Music. Bloomsbury.

See also the homepage for Phoenix Music International, as well as the specific site for Jet Star Records:

https://www.phoenixmusicinternational.com

https://www.jetstar.co.uk/

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All views expressed on this podcast are those of the speakers, and do not necessarily represent the views of the University of Leeds, the School of Music, or any other organisation. Nothing in this podcast should be interpreted as business or legal advice.

How Songs Make Money is created and assembled by Ellis Jones, with contributions from students on the University of Leeds, Music Management MA course. This series is edited by Nikolai Klimanski. Our theme music is also written and produced by Nik Klimanski, and is included with permission. This series of How Songs Make Money is supported by ‘Research Boost’ funding from the Leeds Arts and Humanities Research Institute, and enabled by Digital Education Service’s Podcasting Pilot. Special thanks to Sam Wyman for their support, as well as to Angela Hulme, Mia Windsor, Liev Cherry, and Michelle Schneider.

How Songs Make Money is a podcast series about music rights and the income streams associated with songwriting and composition, hosted by Dr Ellis Jones, Lecturer in Music and Management at the University of Leeds.

Please subscribe to this channel to receive weekly episodes.

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All views expressed on this podcast are those of the speakers, and do not necessarily represent the views of the University of Leeds, the School of Music, or any other organisation. Nothing in this podcast should be interpreted as business or legal advice.

How Songs Make Money is created and assembled by Ellis Jones, with contributions from students on the University of Leeds, Music Management MA course. This series is edited by Nikolai Klimanski. Our theme music is also written and produced by Nik Klimanski, and is included with permission. This series of How Songs Make Money is supported by ‘Research Boost’ funding from the Leeds Arts and Humanities Research Institute, and enabled by Digital Education Service’s Podcasting Pilot. Special thanks to Sam Wyman for their support, as well as to Angela Hulme, Mia Windsor, Liev Cherry, and Michelle Schneider.