In this episode of GTM by the Numbers, host Brandon Redlinger chats with Jacco van der Kooij, founder of Winning by Design, to unpack why most GTM efficiency metrics are dead wrong—and what CROs should be tracking instead. They dive into the Bow Tie model, the rising cost of acquisition, and the untapped power of customer-led growth. If you're leading a SaaS revenue team and questioning whether your metrics actually reflect success, this conversation will give you the clarity, and the playbook, you need.

What you’ll hear in this episode:

• Why most SaaS GTM teams are addicted to acquisition
• How to calculate GTM efficiency and what "good" really looks like
• The impact of operational debt on growth
• How to create customer-led campaigns that scale
• Why post-sale motions are underfunded (and how to fix it)
• When expansion should drive more growth than acquisition
• Why modern sales trips should feel like “Lollapaloozas”
• The rise of HLG (Human-Led Growth) and what to do about it

Resources mentioned in this episode:

Winning by Design AI – “Talk to Jack”: An AI-powered assistant on the Winning by Design site that answers GTM questions and includes hidden “Easter eggs” for curious users.

Link: https://www.winningbydesign.com/ai

Pavilion: A community platform for reps and leaders to leverage for peer-based networking and customer engagement during sales trips.

Link: https://bit.ly/pavilion-membership

David Spitz Reports on SaaS GTM Efficiency: Mentioned as a leading source for analyzing GTM efficiency across public SaaS companies, especially in relation to CAC trends.

Link: https://benchsights.com/

Connect with Jacco

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jaccovanderkooij/
• Winning By Design: https://winningbydesign.com/

Connect with Brandon

• LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/brandonredlinger

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.