We are just two weeks out from Father's Day weekend, and that means it's time for a family reunion at the notorious Mid-State Mile in Franklin, Tennessee. To get our runners mentally locked in, we sit down with two legendary champions who know exactly what it takes to survive the "murder mile": Aaron Dana and Eric Kienle.

This conversation is a total masterclass for anyone stepping onto this course for the first time. Aaron and Eric strip away the illusions of the race on paper and dive straight into the brutal reality of the trail—the steep incline of Myers, the technical quad-burning descents, and the thick canopy that traps 90-degree heat and humidity deep into the night. We deconstruct our own fumbles from year two, trade notes on time-saving gear hacks like elastic Caterpie laces, and talk about how to mentally manage a strict 20-minute loop without letting a pity party or false strength from other runners take you out of the game.

This week on the Dirt & Vert Podcast, we are bringing you a heavy-hitting episode packed with prestige, mindset, and some serious backyard ultra strategy. Hosts David and Matt are joined by two of the absolute animals on the USA Backyard Ultra team: the legendary Harvey Lewis and the powerhouse Mark Dowdle.

Fresh off their massive battle at the BPN Last Man Standing event, Harvey and Mark are joining forces—and going head-to-head—at Tennessee’s notorious Mid-State Mile in Franklin. They dive deep into why they are stepping out of their comfort zones to face 340 feet of grueling elevation gain per loop, how they handle the intense external pressure of media-heavy races, and the specific mental shifts required when the quitting mindset starts sounding reasonable.

Mark shares his transition from college lacrosse to running after being inspired by a David Goggins podcast, while Harvey reflects on his incredible longevity in the sport, having run ultras longer than Mark has been alive. We deconstruct the unique format of Mid-State—where you have a strict 20 minutes to complete 340 feet of elevation gain and loss—and exchange veteran advice on managing body temperature in 90% humidity. From Harvey's 3-minute classroom naps to Mark's relentless "Calendar Club" training blocks, this conversation is a masterclass in locking down your mental game and building a bulletproof crew.

We get a lot of questions about how to get into race directing, how to host fundraisers for charity, and what it actually takes to put on your very first 5K or 10K. In this episode of the Dirt & Vert Podcast, David, Matt, and Mike Taylor break it all down into a simple, high-level roadmap.

We start the day catching up on Mike and Matt's longest 50K ever at the Stump Jump anniversary race—a beautiful, well-marked course where they threw up a thousand times, survived on green and red Gatorade, and battled some classic race director lies about the actual distance to the next aid station. Then, we dive into the nitty-gritty of race directing. From navigating monthly city agenda permits and securing liability insurance policy to choosing a major hosting platform like RunSignUp and finding a local photographer to capture the memories, we share the fumbles we went through so you don't have to.