What does it mean that God takes on human flesh?

In our Nicene Creed series we're tackling these next lines:

Lines: Through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven:

And we're talking with dear friend, mentor, and fellow church planter Rev. Lisa Yebuah, the lead pastor of Southeast Raleigh Table. We tackle the myths around the human body being a divine problem, what it means for our God to suffer and live as one of us, and why the incarnation has a robust meaning in our current political, spiritual, and theological landscape.

More about our guest, Rev. Lisa:

Reverend Lisa Yebuah currently serves as the Lead Pastor of the Southeast Raleigh Table, a United Methodist worshipping community located near downtown Raleigh. She’s a 1999 graduate of Wofford College and a 2004 graduate of Duke University Divinity School. What fuels her life in ministry is seeing people become their whole selves, and in turn, witnessing people live like and believe that the world can be collectively marked by liberation.

Reverend Yebuah is deeply invested in her local community, and works alongside organizations engaged in advocacy for affordable housing, a living wage, access to mental wellness resources, and equity in public education. Most would describe Lisa as a glutton for joy, a lover of people and the enneagram, a self-professed party-starter, and a biscuit connoisseur. She also admits to having a slight obsession with “Abbott Elementary” and “The Office,” and hopes that one day 90’s R&B becomes required listening.

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Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

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Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

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MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

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More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

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More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

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Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

In our Nicene Creed series we're tackling these next lines:

We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
eternally begotten of the Father,
God from God, Light from Light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made,
of one Being with the Father.

And we're joined by the wonderful Rev. future-Dr. Jacob Breeze My LinkedIn-y bio sounds like this:

My congregational experience spans nearly two decades across diverse settings—from revitalizing a small rural parish in North Carolina to strategic leadership in two large, complex organizations with thousands of members and multi-million dollar budgets.

I'm the founder of Holy Family Episcopal, a thriving church for people without a church in Houston's East End, where I lead a 13-person staff and steward a campus housing the LAR Gallery.

In the Diocese of Texas, I teach theology at the Iona School for Ministry, serve as an Examining Chaplain, and train and mentor new clergy. My congregational experience spans nearly two decades across diverse settings—from revitalizing a small rural parish in North Carolina to strategic leadership in two large, complex organizations with thousands of members and multi-million dollar budgets.

I'm currently a PhD candidate in Systematic Theology at Aberdeen. He is an artist, student, and love hanging out with my family and friends. an artist, student, and love hanging out with my family and friends.

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Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

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Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

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MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

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More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

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More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

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Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

Ok, so if God is not a sky daddy, nor actually gendered at all ... why does our definitive statement of faith say God is our "Father"? Why is God the Father, the Almighty? And what do two women who are priests and devout Christians and feminists have to say about all of this language? Does this 1700 year old prayer still hold up?

Resources mentioned in this episode:

Rev. Lizzie talks about a video with three archbishops -- they are Archbishop Angaelos (Coptic Orthodox), Archbishop Bernard Longley (Roman Catholic), and Rowan Williams (former Archbishop of Canterbury) from BBC's Songs of Praise hosted by Pam Rhodes, the program celebrated the 1,700th anniversary of the Nicene Creed and discussed its significance for Christian unity, with a broadcast date of Sunday, October 19, 2025, on BBC One. The clip: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DP6v--sjG9m/

Article by Dr. Karen O'Donnell https://karenodonnell.org.uk/research-papers/can-a-feminist-say-the-nicene-creed

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Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

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MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

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More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

A brief pause in our Nicene Creed miniseries (fret not, it returns next week!) to talk about *clears throat, scary voice ensues* THE HOLIDAYS.

Ok look: we agree. Jesus IS the reason for the season. We're on the precipice of tHe HoLiDaYs and all the madness therein. It's so easy to get sucked into the capitalist machine of Christmas and miss ... Christ. But so much of the energy around "Jesus is the Reason" also feels treacherously coded. How do we navigate this ourselves? And how do we teach our kids that Jesus is the reason, while keeping a sense of wonder and magic alive? How do we do so in a way that engenders respect for people of other faiths and none? We pose these questions with the wonderful Meredith Miller, expert in raising kids with a faith they don't need to heal from.

More about Pastor Meredith:

Website: https://meredithannemiller.com

Book: https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/meredith-miller/woven/9781546004356/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/meredithannemiller/?hl=en

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Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

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MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

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More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

The Nicene Creed is the definitive statement defining Christianity for most Christians, around the world, throughout most of time. Love it or hate it, the Creed binds us together. And since our entire project at And Also With You is reclaiming an ancient Christian faith for modern Christian life, we thought it time to dive deep into this Creed -- to show how this 1700 year old prayer holds up and how we are following it still today.

And it opens with a banger: We believe in One God. But in... three persons? What does that mean, exactly? How does faith in the Trinity inform our life? Like, does it matter that we say this? (It clearly does, we say it a lot but ... why?)

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Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

++++

MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

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More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

Just in time for Halloween, we're talking about the spookiest thing of all: HELL. Or better yet - a belief in hell. Christianity's obsession with hell has us missing out on love, freedom, connection, and justice without punishment. We're joined today by bestselling author Brian Recker to talk about hell, how we unravel its chokehold on our faith, and what life can look like free from this fear.

Brian's book Hell Bent is here!

Lizzie's book (which we also talk about in this episode) is here!

We have one more fun seasonal episode next week before we kick off the much-anticipated miniseries on the Nicene Creed on November 10th!

MORE ABOUT BRIAN + HELL BENT:

A former evangelical pastor explains why we can stop worrying about hell and start focusing on love.

There is a black hole at the center of Christian spirituality: the doctrine of hell. No matter how hard we try to believe in a loving God, the fear of eternal torment always lurks at the back of our minds, warping our sense of what love means. Worse still, many churches act as if the point of Christianity is not to follow Jesus but to secure a get-out-of-hell-free card—and to “save” everyone you know by converting them to your religion. For many of us, the whole story of Christianity has punishment at the very center. But does the Bible really say we’re going to hell if we don’t do or believe the “right” things?

In this taboo-shattering book, former evangelical pastor Brian Recker takes an honest look at scripture and reveals what has been true all along: Hell isn’t real, and God’s universal love is radically inclusive, in this life and the next. By removing punishment from Christianity’s center, Recker boldly reimagines the core questions of faith, such as why Jesus lived and died, and what it means to be “saved.” It’s time to rediscover spirituality as Jesus taught it: loving God, and loving our neighbors as ourselves. Whether you’re Christian, exvangelical, or anywhere along a deconstruction journey, Hell Bent is the perfect resource to help you replace fear and church hurt with healing and peace.

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Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

++++

MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

++++

More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!

There is no freedom or feminism if it isn't for everybody -- so we are really excited to welcome two of our favorite dads to the podcast to talk about Christian parenting: our husbands! Join us for a tender and truthful conversation about why fatherhood is a vocation, a joy, and *not* babysitting your own kids.

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Like what you hear? We are an entirely crowd-sourced, you-funded project.

SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/AndAlsoWithYouPodcast

There's all kinds of perks including un-aired live episodes, Zoom retreats, and mailbag episodes for our Patreons!

+++

Our Website: https://andalsowithyoupod.com

Our Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/andalsowithyoupodcast/

++++

MERCH: https://www.bonfire.com/store/and-also-with-you-the-podcast/

++++

More about Father Lizzie:

BOOK: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/762683/god-didnt-make-us-to-hate-us-by-rev-lizzie-mcmanus-dail/

RevLizzie.com

https://www.instagram.com/rev.lizzie/

https://www.tiktok.com/@rev.lizzie

Jubilee Episcopal Church in Austin, TX - JubileeATX.org

++++

More about Mother Laura:

https://www.instagram.com/laura.peaches/

https://www.tiktok.com/@mother_peaches

St. Paul's Episcopal Church in Pittsburgh, PA

++++

Theme music:

"On Our Own Again" by Blue Dot Sessions (www.sessions.blue).

New episodes drop Mondays at 7am EST/6am CST!