For our 150th episode, we return to a foundational question: why does the desert need people speaking up for it?

Chris offers four answers. Deserts are widely misunderstood as empty or expendable. They remain surprisingly understudied, even when familiar species such as Joshua trees are concerned. Desert protection cannot be separated from Indigenous sovereignty, migration, heat inequality, contaminated water, and the lives of working people. And beneath the science, policy, and activism lies a simpler reason: we love these places.

Listeners Kimberly, Nancy, and Diane share their own reasons for caring about deserts. Fred Bell supplies the nighttime voices of Woodhouse’s and Amargosa toads at Ash Meadows National Wildlife Refuge.

After the closing credits, Chris looks back at the geographical and topical reach of the podcast’s first 150 episodes—and identifies some of the places still missing from the archive.

In this episode:

• Why calling deserts “empty” makes them easier to sacrifice
• Creosote rings, desert fire and ecological time
• How invasive grasses have transformed wildfire in the Mojave
• Why conspicuous desert species can remain surprisingly understudied
• Environmental justice, border communities and urban heat
• What love contributes to conservation
• Where 150 episodes have taken us—and where the podcast needs to go next

Resources and related listening:

• The National Park Service explains how invasive plants can create a cycle of increasingly frequent and extensive Mojave fires: Fire in the Mojave Desert.
• NPS reports that the 2020 Dome Fire burned 43,273 acres, killed as many as 1.3 million Joshua trees and exposed the forest to a potential invasive-grass fire cycle: Dome Fire.
• Related episode: S4E31: Five Years On—Cima Dome After the Flames.
• Related episode: Joshua Trees and Family Trees.
• The Joshua Tree Genome Project and affiliated researchers are using mapping, crowdsourced observations and machine learning to study Joshua tree populations: The Yoder Lab at CSU Northridge.
• NOAA’s current assessment of the strengthening 2026–27 El Niño: ENSO Diagnostic Discussion.
• Related episode: S5E28: Four Things You Need to Know About Desert Flooding.
• Support the podcast at 90milesfromneedles.com/donate.
• Learn about the Fellowship for Desert Reporting at thedamn.org/fellowship.

• Not sure where to start with 150 episodes? Visit our Start Here page for a selection of episodes that offer a good introduction to 90 Miles from Needles.

Become a desert defender!: https://90milesfromneedles.com/donate

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Journalist Joe Dana of 12 News in Phoenix joins Chris Clarke to discuss questions raised by the August 29 flash flood in Grand Canyon National Park—and what happened inside the National Park Service before the disaster.

After the 2025 Dragon Bravo Fire, Grand Canyon Trails Supervisor Adam Gibson warned publicly that the upper North Kaibab Trail had become a substantially more hazardous environment. In a March appearance on The Grand Canyon Hiker Dude Show, Gibson described debris flows, hydrophobic soils and risks likely to persist for years.

Dana's reporting goes further. Sources told him that Gibson had recommended keeping the North Kaibab Trail closed for the 2026 season, and that park leadership initially appeared receptive to that recommendation before the entire trail reopened May 15. NPS had previously described its reopening strategy as adaptive, promising to “open what we can, where we can, when we can,” while balancing visitor safety, resource protection and operational readiness.

Chris and Joe talk about the pressures on park managers to restore public access, the risks faced by trail crews and visitors in a recently burned landscape, and the larger question built into National Park Service management: how do you provide public enjoyment of extraordinary places while ensuring that those places remain unimpaired for future generations? NPS policy says conservation ultimately takes precedence when those purposes genuinely conflict.

The August 29 flood killed two hikers, left a third missing, prompted roughly 80 rescues, and devastated infrastructure along Bright Angel Creek. As of September 8, the North Kaibab Trail, Phantom Ranch, Bright Angel Campground and several other inner-canyon areas remain closed, with no estimated reopening date.

Links and background

Joe Dana and 12 News

Grand Canyon Hiker Dude: Adam Gibson's March 4 interview

NPS: North Rim reopening announcement, March 25

NPS: Current North Rim and North Kaibab Trail status

National Park Service Management Policies: conservation and public enjoyment

Chris will also be taking 90 Miles from Needles to El Paso for the Fourth Chihuahuan Desert Conference, November 4–6, 2026, at the El Paso Zoo and Botanical Gardens.

Chihuahuan Desert Conference information

Become a desert defender!: https://90milesfromneedles.com/donate

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode thumbnail photo by Bo Insogna.

The deadly August 29 flood in Grand Canyon National Park received national attention, but it was not an isolated event. Flooding struck communities, parks and backcountry destinations across Utah, Arizona and New Mexico throughout the summer.

Chris Clarke presents four things we should understand about desert flash floods: they are regional rather than isolated disasters; they are fundamental forces that build desert landscapes; blaming victims can undermine safety; and better preparation, warnings, closures and land-use decisions can reduce the danger. The episode also explains why violent monsoon floods do little to relieve the Colorado River drought.

Key takeaways

• The Grand Canyon flood was part of a much wider period of destructive Southwest monsoon flooding.
• Flash floods are not aberrations in deserts. They carve canyons, move boulders, reroute washes and build alluvial fans.
• Experience and preparation reduce risk, but they cannot eliminate it.
• Blaming victims encourages people to treat safety warnings as advice intended for someone less competent.
• Closures, permits, upstream monitoring, better flood maps and responsible land-use decisions can save lives.
• Intense local flooding does not necessarily produce enough water to replenish major reservoirs or end a regional drought.

Notable quote
“The sustained river incision and the geological uplift are the canvas. The flash floods are the brushstrokes.”

• Griffiths, Peter G., Robert H. Webb, and Theodore S. Melis. 2004. “Frequency and Initiation of Debris Flows in Grand Canyon, Arizona.” Journal of Geophysical Research: Earth Surface 109(F4).
  DOI: 10.1029/2003JF000077
• Melis, Theodore S., Robert H. Webb, Peter G. Griffiths, and T.J. Wise. 1994. Magnitude and Frequency Data for Historic Debris Flows in Grand Canyon National Park and Vicinity, Arizona. USGS Water-Resources Investigations Report 94-4214.
  DOI: 10.3133/wri944214
• Cannon, Susan H., et al. 2008. “Storm Rainfall Conditions for Floods and Debris Flows from Recently Burned Areas in Southwestern Colorado and Southern California.” Geomorphology 96(3–4): 250–269.
  DOI: 10.1016/j.geomorph.2007.03.019
• Goodrich, David C., et al. 2018. “Southwestern Intermittent and Ephemeral Stream Connectivity.” Journal of the American Water Resources Association 54(2): 400–422.
  DOI: 10.1111/1752-1688.12636
• Swain, Daniel L., et al. 2020. “Increased Flood Exposure Due to Climate Change and Population Growth in the United States.” Earth’s Future 8.
  DOI: 10.1029/2020EF001778

Become a desert defender!: https://90milesfromneedles.com/donate

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.