In the Season 3 finale of Giant Steps with Leilani Brown, host Leilani Brown looks back at a season intentionally built to meet the moment of mass layoffs, AI disruption, and career uncertainty.

This best-of episode features curated clips and the six key lessons from Season 3’s most impactful guests.

Dr. Helen Riess, a Harvard psychiatrist, explains why self-compassion—not self-criticism—is the strongest foundation for rebuilding after job loss.

Career strategist Rachel Tully introduces the Boa Constrictor Approach, a targeted job search method she used to land a role at Tesla.

Certified financial planner Michael Daniels walks through the first financial steps after a layoff, from applying for unemployment to protecting your 401(k).

Bestselling author Minda Harts shares her Seven Trust Languages framework for rebuilding workplace trust during restructuring.

Jocelyn Lincoln, a transformational marketing and talent leader, poses the question every leader should ask: if people weren’t paid, would they still follow you?

And executive producer Jirah Mickel puts Leilani in the hot seat for unscripted rapid-fire career advice.

Whether you’re navigating a career transition, leading a team through change, or looking for practical guidance in uncertain times, this episode delivers actionable advice from experts who’ve been there.

Season 4 is coming—subscribe now so you don’t miss it.

0:00 – Welcome & Season 3 Overview

2:34 – Theme Music / Show Intro

3:01 – Dr. Helen Riess: Self-Compassion After Job Loss

5:04 – Rachel Tully: The Boa Constrictor Approach

7:37 – Michael Daniels, CFP®: Financial Clarity in a Crisis

9:50 – Minda Harts: The Seven Trust Languages

13:57 – Jocelyn Lincoln: Would They Follow You Without a Paycheck?

16:59 – Leilani Brown: Trust Your Own Knowing

19:26 – The 6 Lessons of Season 3

21:17 – Season Wrap-Up & Season 4 Coming Soon

Download our free career guide - resetguide.giantstepsllc.com

What if the most powerful leadership development program in America isn’t at Harvard or McKinsey — but has been operating in Black churches for centuries?

L. Michelle Smith — award-winning author, Fortune 100 C-suite advisor, ICF certified executive coach, and CEO of No Silos Communications — joins Leilani to make the case that the Black church is the most overlooked leadership incubator in this country. Her new book, Call and Response: 10 Leadership Lessons from the Black Church, draws on cultural history, applied neuroscience, and positive psychology to show how the skills forged in that experience — communication, resilience, community building, and purpose — are exactly what today’s leaders need. And these lessons aren’t just for Black people or churchgoers. They’re for anyone who wants to lead with more empathy and more power.

In this episode:

— The AT&T keynote that generated 25 million impressions and launched the question: “Where did you learn to speak like that?”

— Why emotional intelligence — not communication — is the least obvious leadership lesson from the church

— How online church became “like Bumble” and what that reveals about workplace communication breakdowns

— The science of hope theory: why hopeful people are better planners, goal setters, and strategists

— What it means to create “safe soil” for emerging leaders — and why ropes courses won’t cut it

— Why young people are the most important — and least obvious — audience for this book

— Plus, a surprise appearance from Rev Run that ties the whole origin story together

About L. Michelle Smith: L. Michelle Smith is an award-winning author, Fortune 100 C-suite advisor, ICF certified executive coach, and CEO and founder of No Silos Communications. She is the executive producer and host of the Culture Soup Podcast, a contributor to HuffPost Voices, and her work has been featured in Fast Company, Forbes, and Black Enterprise. She has spoken on stages including South by Southwest and the Essence Festival. Her new book Call and Response: 10 Leadership Lessons from the Black Church is available now.

Find L. Michelle: LMichelleSmith.com | Instagram | LinkedIn | Threads

Giant Steps is a production of Giant Steps LLC, a company working at the intersection of strategy, culture, career, and education.

Learn more at GiantStepsLLC.com.

Tags/Keywords: leadership, leadership development, Black church, call and response, leadership incubator, positive psychology, hope theory, neuroscience, emotional intelligence, executive coaching, Gen Z, workplace communication, community building, resilience, L. Michelle Smith, Black leadership

Episode Title: If People Weren’t Paid, Would They Follow You? (A Leadership Wake-Up Call)

What actually motivates people to follow a leader — beyond a paycheck?What happens when belief, trust, and clarity matter more than compensation?And how do leaders need to evolve as work, talent, and expectations continue to change?

In this episode of Giant Steps with Leilani Brown, Leilani sits down with Jocelyn Lincoln, a transformational marketing and talent leader, for a candid conversation about leadership, growth, and the human side of work. Jocelyn shares her career journey — from her first job in financial services to executive leadership roles across staffing and healthcare — and the lessons she’s learned along the way about people, purpose, and performance.

Drawing on her experience as a Fractional CMO and executive advisor, Jocelyn unpacks how the workforce has evolved, including the rise of flexible and contingent work, the impact of automation and AI, and the growing talent shortages reshaping industries like healthcare. She also reflects on her experience leading a political campaign, where motivating volunteers offered a powerful lesson in leadership without pay — and why belief may be one of the most underestimated leadership tools.

Together, Leilani and Jocelyn explore what it really takes to lead in today’s environment — and why growth, at every level, ultimately comes down to people.

Whether you’re a leader, manager, or professional navigating change — or questioning whether your leadership would hold without a paycheck — this episode offers perspective, clarity, and a much-needed leadership reset.

• What it means to lead when money isn’t the motivator

• Why belief, trust, and clarity are essential leadership tools

• How flexible and contingent work has reshaped careers

• The impact of AI and automation on today’s workforce

• What healthcare talent shortages reveal about leadership gaps

• Why defining your personal value proposition matters

• Lessons from leading volunteer workforces and political campaigns

Jocelyn Lincoln

Jocelyn Lincoln is a Fractional CMO with Chief Outsiders and a transformational marketing and talent leader with more than two decades of experience across staffing, healthcare, and growth strategy. She works with CEOs and leadership teams to drive growth through clarity, alignment, and execution, helping organizations rethink how they attract, retain, and lead talent in a rapidly changing workforce.

Leilani BrownWebsite → https://giantstepsllc.comInstagram → @giantstepsllc

Jocelyn LincolnLinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/jocelynlincoln/ Website / Chief Outsiders → https://www.chiefoutsiders.com/

🎁 Free guide: Your Next Giant Reset™ — a step-by-step resource for navigating loss, layoffs, and planning your comeback.👉 Download it here: https://resetguide.giantstepsllc.com/#page=1

📚 More free resources & writing:Read the Giant Steps blog and download additional resources on Substack →👉 https://giantstepsllc.substack.com/

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