What if the advice to avoid talking about politics is actually making everything worse? In our first-ever guest interview, we sit down with Monica Guzman - author of "I Never Thought of It That Way," and advisor at Braver Angels to talk about how to have fearlessly curious conversations in dangerously divided times.

Monica doesn't sugarcoat it: America is fraying. Social media has made it easy to be incurious while feeling righteous, and "conflict entrepreneurs" are profiting off our division. But she believes the only way forward is to keep talking to each other, especially across disagreement.

Her advice for navigating political conversations - especially during the holidays: • Know what you're after: connection or persuasion?

• Step away from social media and have tough conversations face-to-face

• Ask "how" instead of "why" - invite people to share their story, not defend their position

• Remember that curiosity and grace are contagious

Monica shares a powerful story about bringing liberal Seattleites to meet conservative Oregon farmers. What they discovered: we're all terrible at estimating what the "other side" really thinks. Studies show both liberals and conservatives wildly overestimate support for extreme positions like political violence. The best intervention? Talking to real people, not caricatures.

Some argue America should split into "Divided States." Monica pushes back hard: that's a lie pushed by extremes for political gain. The truth? The more time we spend only with people who agree with us, the dumber we get. We need each other to make wise decisions for a healthy society.

Is there hope? Absolutely. The revolution isn't happening in halls of power - it's happening in living rooms, coffee shops, and podcasts. People choosing dialogue over dismissal are the real counterculture.

Monica leaves us with "sonder" - the realization that every person has a life as vivid and complex as your own. When we remember that, everything changes.

Read Monica's book "I Never Thought of It That Way" and join the movement toward fearless curiosity.

CHAPTER MARKERS:

00:00 - Introduction: Why We Talk Across Political Divides

00:21 - Meet Monica Guzman: Author of "I Never Thought of It That Way"

01:36 - Is America More Divided Than Ever?

03:14 - Social Media, Outrage, and the Curiosity Crisis

05:27 - How to Have Difficult Conversations With Family

08:09 - The Power of Curiosity and Grace in Bridge Building

09:49 - Why "How" Questions Work Better Than "Why"

11:57 - Breaking Down Misconceptions About the Other Side

14:16 - Monica’s Sherman County Project: Liberals Meet Conservatives

18:30 - What Urban and Rural America Can Learn From Each Other

21:58 - Are We Really Hopelessly Divided?

24:16 - Why We Need Each Other: The Beating Heart of Democracy

27:00 - Signs of Hope: The Revolution of Conversation

29:10 - Sonder: Seeing the Humanity in Everyone

30:53 - Would You Rather: Monica’s Game on Difference

33:44 - Final Thoughts and Thank You to Monica Guzman

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Connect with Monica:

https://www.moniguzman.com/book

https://braverangels.org/author/moniguzmangmail-com/

LINKS

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On Apple Podcasts:

There's a massive group of Americans we don’t talk enough about; people who work full-time, pay their taxes, and still can't afford basic necessities. They earn too much to qualify for government assistance but too little to actually survive. They're called ALICE: Asset Limited, Income Constrained, Employed. And they represent 38 million households (29% of America). Combined with those below the federal poverty line, that's 55 million households, or 42% of the entire country, struggling to make ends meet.

I (Jolene) learned about ALICE through a friend who works for United Way, and honestly, it changed how I think about poverty in America. As a conservative, I've always believed in personal responsibility and hard work. But ALICE represents people who are doing everything right - working full-time jobs, showing up every day, contributing to society, and yet they still can't make ends meet. That's not a character failure. That's a system failure.

Nicole's perspective as a liberal aligns with mine on this more than you'd expect. She sees ALICE as proof that the social safety net has massive gaps. You can work full-time and still not afford childcare, housing, transportation, and healthcare. The federal poverty line is outdated and doesn't reflect the actual cost of living, which is exactly why United for ALICE created the Household Survival Budget. This is a metric that reflects the real minimum costs of necessities like housing, childcare, food, transportation, healthcare, and technology, plus taxes, adjusted for every county in the United States.

You can get involved with United for ALICE through their website at unitedforalice.org or through United Way in your state. You can donate, volunteer, or advocate for policies that support working families. You can also just start talking about this issue, because the first step to solving a problem is acknowledging it exists.

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

United for ALICE:

https://www.unitedforalice.org/ United Way: https://www.unitedway.org/ United Way National Overview (Interactive Map): https://unitedforalice.org/national-overview#4.5/36.316/-95.842

Books: Abundance by Ezra Klein: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Abundance/Ezra-Klein/9781668023488

Good for the Soul:

Ezra Klein & Spencer Cox: https://youtu.be/WJB87niNCk0?si=o7alUusFQMsS1I-6

Social Media/Inspiration:

James Talarico (Instagram):

https://www.instagram.com/jamestalarico/?hl=en

Plumes Officiel (Instagram):

https://www.instagram.com/plumesofficiel/

Business Resources:

Mark Cuban MasterClass - Win Big in Business: https://www.masterclass.com/classes/win-big-in-business/chapters/win-big-in-business Mark

Cuban Cost Plus Drug...

Thanksgiving is supposed to be about gratitude, family, and great food - but with tensions running high in America, the holidays might feel more charged than usual. In this episode, we share how to actually enjoy Thanksgiving without avoiding meaningful conversation or ending up in a screaming match.

Growing up, our Thanksgivings looked different but felt the same: togetherness, gratitude, and way too much food. Now as adults with our own traditions and chosen families, we've learned something crucial: curiosity beats judgment every single time.

When someone says something you disagree with at the dinner table, what if you asked a genuine question instead of arguing? Questions that start with "how" instead of "why" invite conversation instead of confrontation. How did you come to that conclusion? How does that affect you personally? These questions create understanding instead of arguments.

Everyone is the protagonist in their own story, operating from their own experiences and values. When you approach conversations from that perspective, it's easier to listen without immediately judging.

This doesn't mean agreeing with everything or abandoning your boundaries. It means approaching disagreement with curiosity about how someone arrived at their position, rather than dismissing them.

We're proof that people with completely different political views can genuinely enjoy each other's company. The secret isn't agreeing on everything; it's respecting each other enough to listen, ask questions, and assume good faith.

This Thanksgiving, approach your gathering with an open heart and genuine curiosity. Set boundaries if needed, but don't avoid all meaningful conversations just because they might be uncomfortable. Some of the best memories come from real conversations where vulnerability and honesty create connection instead of conflict.

Happy Thanksgiving from two friends who prove that liberals and conservatives can break bread together without breaking each other.

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Luby's:

https://www.lubys.com/

Kerrygold USA:

https://www.kerrygoldusa.com/

Good for the Soul:

People Choosing Kindness (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/peoplechoosingkindness/

Tangle:

https://youtu.be/_ys-UNz5U24?si=sNsUCJ3LVAreVQWN

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/

We're about to talk about religion, which means a good portion of you just got a little uncomfortable. But here's something wild that might make this conversation easier: science shows that prayer and meditation do essentially the same thing to your brain. Whether you're a Christian praying in a church or an atheist meditating in your living room, your brain is having a remarkably similar experience. Today we're taking a look at why these practices work, how they're more alike than different, and why maybe we should all stop arguing about whose version is "right."

Whether you pray to God, meditate on your breath, or find peace in nature, you're tapping into something fundamental about human consciousness. You're creating space for stillness in a noisy world. You're cultivating compassion in a culture that often rewards cruelty. You're choosing presence over distraction.

We're not here to convert anyone to prayer or meditation. We're here to share what works for us and invite you to explore what might work for you. Maybe it's the practice you grew up with. Maybe it's something completely new. Maybe it's a combination of traditions that speaks to your specific experience.

The invitation is simple: get curious. Explore. Try things. Notice what creates peace, connection, and clarity in your life. And then do more of that, regardless of what it's called or where it comes from.

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Dr. Andrew Newberg Content:

The Mel Robbins Podcast with Dr. Andrew Newberg: https://youtu.be/zVXOyp0q9pA?si=EH_9NfllFj48v1jJ

Dr. Andrew Newberg TED Talk:

https://youtu.be/7SJCDLHyeqk?si=Jq3ncdR6w4Pv0WdD Additional Video: https://youtu.be/JdVmBH7HYoY?si=Adw5nPkLyL7ifJHM

Prayer and Meditation Resources:

Jesus Calling:

https://www.jesuscalling.com/

Good for the Soul:

Ohhthatsrich (Instagram):

https://www.instagram.com/ohhthatsrich/?hl=en

60 Minutes with Spencer Cox:

https://youtu.be/sk8Ct961EMc?si=KVWxThdZXA9rVFQe

Books and Educational Resources:

TA for Tots: https://archive.org/details/tafortotsandothe0000free

Science and Nature:

James Webb Telescope - Space Telescope Science Institute: https://youtu.be/xID7xvIYmEk?si=1U06VfpZ-gR3nDUw

Miscellaneous:

The Protest Rats (NYC Reddit):...

Menopause is a natural life transition that half the population will experience, yet somehow it remains medicine's best-kept secret.

I (Nicole) spent months getting shuffled between specialists, each one treating individual symptoms without connecting the obvious dots. Itchy skin? See a dermatologist. Mood changes? Try therapy. Bone loss? Take calcium supplements.

Each doctor had a different diagnosis. None of them mentioned menopause.

Then came the osteoporosis diagnosis, and suddenly everything clicked. But it shouldn't have taken a bone density scan to get answers about something as predictable as menopause.

Today we're talking about why women's health care is broken, how hormone replacement therapy changed everything, and why the medical establishment would rather prescribe antidepressants than admit they don't understand women's bodies.

DISCLAIMER:

While we make every effort to make sure the information in this podcast/article is accurate and informative, the information does not take the place of professional or medical advice.

Do not use our information:

• to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease
• for therapeutic purposes
• as a substitute for the advice of a health professional.

We do not accept any liability for any injury, loss or damage caused by use of the information provided in our podcast.

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Dr. Mary Claire Haver (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/drmaryclaire/?hl=en

Dr. Mary Claire Haver on Armchair Expert: https://armchairexpertpod.com/pods/mary-claire-haver

The Dr. Hyman Show Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-dr-hyman-show/id1382804627

North American Menopause Society: https://menopause.org/

Dr. Adrienne Simone: https://dradriennesimone.com/

Dr. Amy Grace (Tulane): https://medicine.tulane.edu/departments/obstetrics-gynecology/faculty/amy-grace-md

Dr. Vonda Wright (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/drvondawright/?hl=en

Dr. Kelly Casperson (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/kellycaspersonmd/?hl=en

Midlife Private Parts: https://www.midlifeprivateparts.com/

Video Content:

YouTube Live Stream: https://www.youtube.com/live/_2ZRlOivC5M?si=FtyFdcBwX2eoPeQl

Dr Mary Claire on Katie Couric: https://youtu.be/lkDNlXHzD2M?si=BWNBIamLD0d1NJ_n

Dr Mary Claire on Mel Robbins: https://youtu.be/ReFZ__ZeSEQ?si=YNrZHvY6b8CXh03t

Dr Mary Claire on Diary of A CEO:

California Governor Gavin Newsom is everywhere right now - doing podcasts, engaging with conservative voices, and very obviously positioning himself for a 2028 presidential run. He's got the hair, the charisma, and the baggage that comes with governing California. Today we're talking about whether Newsom could actually win a national election, and whether the kid I (Nicole) knew from afar in high school, wearing blazers and slicked-back hair, could actually become president.

I (Nicole) went to high school with Gavin Newsom. Even back then, he had this air of sophistication that set him apart. While the rest of us were in jeans and t-shirts, Gavin showed up in blazers looking like he was already running for something. It's surreal to think that the same person I knew as a teenager might shape America's political future. But what's actually beneath that perfectly coiffed exterior?

Jolene's been watching Newsom with curiosity. As a conservative, she sees him as the political shapeshifter of our time. Someone with Bill Clinton-level charisma who can connect across party lines, but who also carries the weight of California's very visible problems. Homelessness, crime, cost of living, people fleeing the state - these aren't just Republican talking points; they're real issues that Newsom would have to answer for on a national stage.

What's interesting to both of us is how Newsom forces a conversation about what we actually want in leaders. Do we want perfectly polished politicians who never make mistakes, or do we want flawed humans who own their failures and try to do better? Do we want leaders who only talk to people who agree with them, or do we want someone willing to engage across ideological lines?

Jolene's watching to see if Newsom can address California's problems convincingly. I'm watching to see if his authenticity and communication skills can translate to a national campaign. We're both curious about whether someone who's willing to talk to Steve Bannon and Charlie Kirk can actually bridge America's political divide, or if that's just good PR.

The real test will be whether Newsom can turn his podcast conversations and long-form interviews into actual policy solutions that resonate with voters outside of California. Charisma is great, vulnerability is appealing, but ultimately people want leaders who can improve their lives. Can Newsom make that case? We'll find out.

CHAPTER MARKERS:

00:00 Introduction

00:22 Community Building and Sponsorship

01:21 Diving into Gavin Newsom

02:54 High School Memories and Personal Anecdotes

04:37 Gavin Newsom's Political Journey

08:14 Reflections on Newsom's Public Image

16:34 Newsom's COVID Controversy

19:38 Challenges and Criticisms of Newsom's Governance

21:37 Homelessness and Housing Policies

22:15 Election Integrity Concerns

22:46 Gavin Newsom's Public Perception

24:33 Podcast Discussions and Public Reactions

26:55 Transgender Athletes in Sports

27:28 Gavin Newsom's Political Journey

33:38 Personal Reflections and Vulnerability

35:41 Social Media and Political Image

39:17 Would You Rather

42:32 Concluding Thoughts and Future Speculations

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

Gavin Newsom Content: Gavin Newsom TikTok (Specific Video): https://www.tiktok.com/@gavinnewsom/video/7557082684074315039 Gavin Newsom TikTok Profile: https://www.tiktok.com/@gavinnewsom?lang=en

Interview and Media Appearances: Steven Colbert Interview 1:...

President Trump is building a new ballroom at the White House, and predictably, everyone has lost their minds. Some people see it as a practical addition for official events. Others see it as an extravagant monument to Trump's ego being permanently installed in the people's house. Today, we're talking about why a ballroom has become yet another flashpoint in American politics, and whether maybe we're all just exhausted and looking for things to be angry about.

I (Jolene) get why people are upset about this, but honestly, the ballroom doesn't bother me. Here's why: it's being funded by private donations, not taxpayer money. Every president leaves their mark on the White House - renovations, updates, changes that reflect their time in office. Trump sees this ballroom as his legacy project, and since he's not using public funds, I don't see the problem. Having a dedicated space for official events instead of constantly setting up temporary solutions is actually practical.

Nicole's reaction wasn’t too dissimilar as far as understanding the need for a larger space for events, but from a Liberal’s perspective, the ballroom feels like Trump literally building a monument to himself in the White House. It's not just about the money; it's about what it represents. At a time when Americans are struggling financially, when budgets are tight and people are worried about making ends meet, building an opulent ballroom feels tone-deaf and dismissive.

The ballroom will get built and Trump will leave office eventually. But the way we treat each other, the way we engage with people who disagree with us, the way we choose dialogue over dismissal - that's what will determine whether we can actually function as a country.

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

White House Information: White House Official History: https://www.whitehouse.gov/about-the-white-house/the-white-house/

News and Analysis: Jessica Yellin (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/reel/DQK8_hUEluJ/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link The Hill - 5

Takeaways from East Wing Construction: https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/5570860-trump-white-house-ballroom-east-wing-takeaways/

The Hill - White House Releases Donor List: https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/5569197-major-companies-fund-whitehouse/

Good for the Soul:

Monica Lewinsky's Reclaiming Podcast: https://wondery.com/shows/reclaiming-with-monica-lewinsky/

Ken Colman (Instagram): https://www.instagram.com/reel/DOOLHvZhzxX/?igsh=MXBiaHA1ZGpjM3MzaA==

LINKS

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole

President Trump did something remarkable in the Middle East. I (Nicole) can barely believe I'm typing this, but credit where it's due - he got hostages home and negotiated a ceasefire in a conflict that's been bleeding for decades. Whether you love Trump or hate him, what happened this week deserves acknowledgment. And that's exactly what we're talking about today.

We're not declaring Trump a hero or pretending this solves the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. We're also not ignoring what he accomplished because we disagree with his politics. We're doing what we should all do more often: recognizing when someone does something significant, even if we didn't think they could.

Every step toward peace matters, even if it's small, even if it's imperfect, even if it comes from someone you didn't expect. The hostages are home. People who were separated from their families are together again. That's real. That's worth celebrating. And that's also just the beginning of a much longer, messier process that will require sustained effort from everyone involved.

RESOURCES MENTIONED:

BBC News Article:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ckgr71z0jp4o

Good for ths Soul:

https://youtu.be/RP8Oxe6OxJc?si=sP7k_V4g9R-CYCLs

LINKS:

On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/wevegottotalk/

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WeveGotToTalk

How to find Nicole https://nicolefonarow.com/

How to find Jolene https://dibledough.com/