Welcome back to This Person I Met! My name is Kayla, and I’m the host of this podcast.

I don’t personally identify with any particular religious label, but one thing I know is for certain: Western religion, or at least the way it is often practiced, has never felt like it was made for me. For many people who feel similarly, it is easy to turn this divide into resentment or even hatred. Sometimes, that divide can feel inevitable. When I look at the state of the world and see the ways that religion can intersect with higher institutions, politics, and the lives of people like me, it can feel difficult not to feel entirely disconnected from those who hold different beliefs.

However, I believe it is more important than ever to communicate and have conversations with people who see the world differently and listen to their beliefs in order to find a space where we are all comfortable enough to share.

In this second segment with Deborah, a pastor at the Church of the Good Shepherd, we continue our conversation about this divide and explore its deep roots in American and international politics. If you haven’t listened to the first part yet, I recommend taking a look.

Welcome back to This Person I Met! My name is Kayla, and I’m the host of this podcast.

Especially within my generation, I can feel a divide forming; one that has always existed but is becoming especially apparent as politics and society continuously exacerbate it. That divide being the debate of whether or not religion should play a role in higher institutions, and especially in political spaces. On one hand, religion is an inevitable part of people’s worldview and who they are, something that is always going to be represented in politics. On another hand, religion is not everybody’s worldview, and a neutral ground where no religion is involved is just as necessary. This past month, I met with Deborah, a pastor at The Church of the Good Shepherd in Ann Arbor, Michigan. In this first segment, we discuss the secularization of American society, right-wing Christian Nationalism, and most importantly, the delicate balance between church and state.

Without further ado, here’s Deborah.

Welcome back to This Person I Met! My name is Kayla, and I’m the host of this podcast.

I could feel Linda’s eyes on me as I packed up my podcast equipment, hurrying to leave the dim-lit room for my next endeavor. At 83-years-old, Linda had been sober for over 40 years after near decades as an active addict, a journey she had shared in her thirty-minute interview in which we discussed God, happiness, and alcohol. Through her smile, she offered one last piece of her wisdom.

“I feel like, in some way, you understand it all a little more than the average person,” she said to me. “You’re a minority. It’s similar to being the child of an addict—we were born with a price to pay.”

As I left, her words still imprinted in my mind, I was firmly reminded that there are no differences that can separate us from wanting to understand each other in any means possible; that being said, there is always a way to empathize with anybody no matter how different you believe you may be.

Beyond the topic of addiction was an incessant reminder of humanity and how empathy and a desire to understand somebody who shares little in common with you can help those who might be struggling. In the wise words of Maya Angelou, we are more alike than we are unalike.

Without further ado, here’s Linda.