Too many salespeople chase titles instead of tackling real challenges.

In this episode of The Marketing Phoenix Podcast, host Melissa “Rogo” Rogozinski is joined by law firm buyers of legal tech, Marimer Muñoz (Kluger Kaplan) and Emily Bartkowicz (Akerman), to explore how consultative selling and solution selling can make or break your discovery calls.

For legal tech, law firm, and B2B professionals, this discussion sheds light on the cost of poor outreach, the importance of objection handling, and how to shorten the sales cycle by listening first and pitching second.

What You’ll Learn:

• Why selling to titles instead of pain points fails
• How consultative selling builds trust with busy legal teams
• Discovery Call best practices that win meetings (and respect)
• Simple ways to tailor outreach to law firm stakeholders
• The role patience plays in the long B2B sales cycle

SEO Keywords: consultative selling, solution selling, discovery call, objection handling, sales cycle

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Too many sales pros walk into key accounts without a strategy and end up wasting opportunities ripe for conversion.

In this episode of The Marketing Phoenix Podcast, Melissa “Rogo” Rogozinski shares a personal story that forever changed the way she approached B2B sales and client acquisition.

If you’re in legal tech, a law firm, or any B2B field, this episode is packed with practical steps to transform short discovery calls into long-term client relationships using marketing intelligence and a Strategic Account Plan (SAP).

What You’ll Learn:

• Why walking into a meeting without a plan is a “fool’s errand”
• The 8 essential components of a Strategic Account Plan (SAP)
• How to qualify leads with frameworks like BANT, CHAMP, and MEDDICC
• Ways to align your solutions with your prospect’s biggest challenges
• How SAPs increase sales productivity and improve discovery calls

How to Use an SAP to Turn the Sales Process Into a Buying Process

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SEO Keywords: B2B Sales, Marketing Intelligence, Sales Strategy, Sales Productivity, Discovery Call

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Your sales team is hustling hard, but win rates aren’t moving. The real problem? You might be selling to the wrong Ideal Client Profile (ICP).

In this episode of The Marketing Phoenix Podcast, Melissa “Rogo” Rogozinski sits down with sales leader CJ Webster to unpack the risks of targeting the wrong ICPand how it quietly sabotages your sales forecasting, sales pipeline, and revenue growth.

For legal tech companies, law firms, and B2B organizations, the key to sustainable success isn’t just lead generation: It’s aligning your product or service, marketing intelligence, and sales reps’ strategies with the right ICP. Melissa and CJ reveal why misalignment across marketing, product, sales, and customer service creates wasted effort, lost deals, and frustrated buyers.

They also share how sales reps can improve objection handling, build trust during the buying process, and use data driven decisions to refine case studies and customer feedback for better targeting. The result? Closed deals that are a good fit for both the buyer and the vendor’s bottom line.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• Why most B2B sales teams close fewer deals than they should
• The six ICP roles that shape purchasing decisions
• How misaligned ICP targeting disrupts the sales pipeline
• The role of storytelling, sales pitches, and objection handling in winning customers
• Why customer experiences and building relationships matter more than cold calls
• How aligning teams leads to smarter, data driven decisions and more closed deals

Chapters:

00:10 Boosting Win Rates With the Right ICP
00:42 Introducing CJ Webster
01:00 Creating and Evolving ICPs
01:20 Defining Six Types of ICPs
02:58 Selling Enterprise Tech Solutions the Right Way
07:10 Recognizing Signs of the Wrong ICP
09:54 Clarifying Value Before Selling to the ICP
13:33 Defining Law Firm ICP by Role, Practice, Size
14:16 Understanding Why Clients Choose Knowledge Over Features
15:15 Involving Marketing, Product, Sales, and Client Success
16:30 Breaking Down ICP Levels: Company, Practice, Stakeholder
22:29 Avoiding Bad Deals With the Right ICP
23:35 Defining RPC’s Real Client Personas
24:26 Shifting Focus From Big Law to SMB Firms
25:52 Leveling the Playing Field for SMB Law Firms With AI
27:14 Explaining AI Simply to Law Firm Buyers
30:34 Understanding Sales Challenges in Tech Integration
32:15 Leveraging AI for Sales Analyses
35:18 Navigating a Crowded AI Marketplace
39:07 Solving Why Sales Can’t Convert MQLs
42:43 Fixing Content That Attracts the Wrong ICPs
47:47 Diagnosing Why Sales and Marketing Fail to Deliver
51:50 Learning Why Sales and Marketing Miss Leads
55:35 CJ’s Final Thoughts on Sales Nobility

SEO Keywords:

Sales forecasting, B2B Sales, Marketing intelligence. LSI: Sales cycle, Objection handling

Connect with CJ Webster: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cj-webster/

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If your prospects are ghosting you, the problem may not be your pitch — it’s your research. Discover how to find the right decision-makers, prepare smarter, and turn cold calls into warm conversations.

Overview:

Legal tech sales, law firm business development, and B2B Sales all have one thing in common — the most successful reps never skip research. In this Marketing Phoenix Podcast episode, Melissa “Rogo” Rogozinski talks with Corey Douglas, VP of eDiscovery Services at Repairio Data LLC. Corey shares clear, step-by-step ways top salespeople find the right decision-makers, use marketing support, and turn first meetings into helpful, problem-solving conversations.

Whether you work with law firms, corporate legal teams, or other B2B Lead Generation Companies, you’ll see why Sales and Marketing Alignment helps close more deals and how to avoid the most common outreach mistakes.

What You’ll Learn:

• How to identify true decision-makers vs. gatekeepers
• Tools and platforms that streamline B2B prospect research
• Ways to use buyer personas for better outreach and messaging
• Turning discovery meetings into consultative conversations
• How marketing and sales alignment accelerates deal cycles
• Why AI is your secret weapon for personalized outreach

Chapters:

00:12 – Closing Deals Like Top Sales Reps
01:00 – Introducing Corey Douglas of Repario Data
03:08 – Identifying the Right Prospect to Target
05:39 – Understanding Why Buying Capability Matters
06:05 – Avoiding Mistakes with Paralegal ICPs
07:38 – Using ICP Roles to Book Meetings
08:38 – Rethinking General Counsel as the Buyer
09:43 – Evaluating If Attorney Is the Right ICP
10:20 – Mapping Gatekeepers, Influencers, and Decision-Makers
12:28 – Preparing for Discovery Meetings with Research
18:21 – Stopping the Feature-First Sales Pitch
22:30 – Asking the Most Powerful Sales Question
23:23 – Supporting Sales Prospecting with Marketing
26:22 – Sharing Content That Moves Sales Forward
28:40 – Showing How Research Helps Close Deals
30:03 – Sharing Sales Tips: Networking, Research, AI

Keywords:

B2B Sales, B2B Lead Generation Companies, Sales and Marketing Alignment

Connect with Corey Douglas, JD.

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Whether you're managing leads in a startup or navigating enterprise-level sales, choosing the right lead qualification framework is the key to closing smarter, faster, and more profitably.

In this episode of The Marketing Phoenix Podcast, host Melissa “Rogo” Rogozinski breaks down three powerhouse sales frameworks—BANT, CHAMP, and MEDDICC—to help you qualify leads with clarity, confidence, and consistency.

For legal tech, SaaS, and B2B companies looking to refine their go to market consulting or growth strategies, this episode delivers a tactical breakdown of when and how each framework performs best—and how marketing plays a critical role in setting the stage for sales success.

What You’ll Learn:

• When to use BANT, CHAMP, or MEDDICC based on deal complexity
• How to ask the right qualification questions at the right time
• Specific examples that tie frameworks to real-world B2B use cases
• Why marketing should align with sales frameworks from day one
• How content and campaigns can drive qualification before a rep calls
• What marketing leaders should know to support enterprise sales teams

Keywords: managing leads, go to market consulting, growth strategies

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Episode Summary:

Melissa "Rogo" Rogozinski sits down with Gil Wolchock, VP of Outside Sales at Steno, to unpack two powerhouse sales mindsets: the “HUNTERS” and the “Challenger.” Together, they explore how today’s best sales teams leverage consultative selling, marketing alignment, and RevOps strategy to close more deals in competitive markets like legal tech.

Whether you lead sales at a startup, scale-up, or enterprise, this episode provides a deep dive into how buyer personas, multi-threaded prospecting, and AI-enabled tools are changing the game.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• The key traits of sales HUNTERS and how they’re evolving
• How the Challenger Sale's “Teach, Tailor, Take Control” still holds power
• How legal tech sales differ from traditional SaaS
• Where marketing fits into each stage of the sales cycle
• Why belief in your product is non-negotiable
• How to turn insights into buying signals and win deals faster

Connect with Gil Wolchock.

Keywords:

email marketing, growth marketing, sales process, legal tech, buyer personas

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Too many companies confuse product marketing with product management—costing them alignment, customers, and revenue. Learn how to unify your strategy and drive results.

In this final episode of the Marketing Phoenix Podcast's six-month Growth Marketing Series, Melissa Rogozinski sits down with B2B product strategy consultant, Tina John, to unpack the critical differences and collaboration points between product management and product marketing.

Whether you're launching, scaling, or preparing to exit, Rogo and Tina break down the essential frameworks and practical steps to align your go-to-market strategy, support sales, and accelerate sustainable growth.

What You’ll Learn:

• The difference between product management and product marketing—and where they overlap
• Why product strategy is central to successful go-to-market planning
• How to prioritize growth strategies at each business stage: startup, scale-up, or exit
• What makes sales enablement essential for increasing valuation
• The role of competitive and market research in building a strong growth marketing foundation
• How aligning product and marketing teams drives faster execution and better KPIs

Chapters:

• 00:46 – Introducing the 6 Pillars of Growth Marketing
• 01:25 – Exploring Tina John’s Product Strategy Background
• 02:27 – Comparing Product Management and Marketing
• 03:45 – Identifying Overlap Between PM and PMM
• 04:24 – Defining Buyers Versus Customers
• 04:58 – Developing a Strong Product Strategy
• 06:51 – Aligning Product Management and Marketing
• 07:43 – Recognizing the Need for Product Strategy
• 09:21 – Using Messaging in Product Marketing
• 12:40 – Tying Business Goals to Product Messaging
• 13:54 – Supporting Sales Through Product Strategy
• 15:26 – Using VOC to Shape Product Strategy
• 17:24 – Evolving Product Strategy: A Real Example
• 20:17 – Outlining the 3 Pillars of Strategy
• 21:38 – Enabling Sales with Strategic Tools
• 22:10 – Building Vision and a Roadmap
• 27:03 – Conducting Competitive and Market Research
• 28:47 – Knowing Where to Start with Strategy
• 33:46 – Recapping Strategy, Management, and Marketing
• 34:39 – Aligning PM and PMM for Business Growth
• 35:46 – Driving Close Rates Through Product Strategy

Episode Resources:

• Strategic Product Management That Positions, Aligns, and Empowers
• RPC Strategies' Portfolio

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What’s the real reason your prospects aren’t buying? Spoiler: it’s not your pricing.

In this episode of The Marketing Phoenix Podcast, Melissa “Rogo” Rogozinski breaks down a practical, structured approach to sales that empowers prospects to choose your solution. No pushy tactics, just proven strategies that turn preparation and follow-through into closed deals.

Whether you’re running sales for a legal tech startup or leading a B2B scale-up, these insights will help you tighten your sales process and boost conversion rates.

What You’ll Learn:

• How to structure your CRM to improve sales focus and lead tracking
• Practical ways to warm up existing clients for more business
• A structured cold prospecting outreach cadence that works
• How to build a Strategic Account Plan that gets attention
• The role of cross-functional collaboration in revenue growth

Tune in and turn preparation into profit.

Keywords: Growth strategies, lead tracking, lead management and CRM

Episode Resources:

• How to Use an SAP to Turn the Sales Process into a Buying Process
• 6 Ways to Leverage the Power of Process and Workflows in Sales
• Sales Enablement
• B2B Product Marketing

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• The Proven Sales Email Codex
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