The Herle Burly was created by Air Quotes Media with support from our presenting sponsor TELUS, as well as CN Rail.

Greetings, you curiouser and curiouser Herle Burly-ites! Back in July, the Wall Street Journal ran a striking series on how Europe is quietly rethinking its arrangements with the world to counter a changing, increasingly predatory United States. And surprisingly, named Mark Carney as one of the leaders pushing Europe in that direction, pointing back to his Davos speech and his idea of "variable geometry" alliances replacing the old hub-and-spoke reliance on Washington.

We want to explore these themes: what does it means for institutions like NATO and the G7 to become secondary to newer, looser alignments? How does the Western world meet the challenge of China going forward? And what does all of this mean for Canada's economy and its place in the world?

To dig into it, we bring in two brilliant people today: Jennifer Welsh and Colin Robertson.

Jennifer Welsh is a four-time guest of the pod, Rhodes Scholar, co-founder of the Oxford Institute for Ethics, Law and Armed Conflict. Currently, the Director of the Max Bell School of Public Policy at McGill University.

And making his first appearance, Colin Robertson. He served as a Canadian diplomat for over 30 years. He helped negotiate the original Canada/U.S. Free Trade Agreement and NAFTA. Currently, he’s a Fellow at the Canadian Global Affairs Institute and host of its Global Exchange podcast.

They dig into why countries from Europe to Australia to South Korea are hedging their bets on America, what "variable geometry" actually looks like in practice, whether the G7 and G20 are still fit for the world we live in, and some genuinely concrete questions too. Like whether Canada should still buy the F-35, and why Mexico deserves to be treated as a real ally rather than a partner of convenience.

A fascinating, wide-ranging conversation about what's replacing the old international order, and Canada's surprising role at the centre of it. Stay with us for the hour.

Thank you for joining us on #TheHerleBurly podcast. Please take a moment to give us a rating and review on iTunes, Spotify, or your favourite podcast app.

Watch episodes of The Herle Burly via Air Quotes Media on YouTube.

The sponsored ads contained in the podcast are the expressed views of the sponsor and not those of the publisher.

The Herle Burly was created by Air Quotes Media with support from our presenting sponsor TELUS, as well as CN Rail.

Greetings, you curiouser and curiouser Herle Burly-ites! This one's for anyone tired of the heat-with-no-light that passes for policy debate on Twitter. David brings together three super smart policy minds who understand government — spanning different ideologies and varying degrees of partisanship. It’s a rare, respectful, rational, 90-minute conversation about the predicament Canada finds itself in and what policy steps the country should take next in this trade war with the US.

Tyler Meredith, Jennifer Robson, and Ginny Roth dig into whether Canada should still be racing back to the table with the Americans, or whether this is finally the moment to build real independence from that relationship. They debate what's actually achievable through internal free trade. Tyler makes the case the economic models behind it are, in his words, "bullshit" and why Canadian businesses have been sitting on their capital for the better part of a decade.

They’ll also discuss what it means that the federal government has quietly become one of the country's biggest investors: building and owning pipelines, de-risking major projects, and increasingly deciding which sectors to grow.

They dig into the politically thorny stuff too: interprovincial trade barriers nobody wants to touch, the tanker ban, First Nations consultation, and why "brain drain" needs to come back into the conversation.

And they close on the immediate question of who's actually hurting right now: auto workers, steel workers, forestry towns … and whether EI, retraining, and liquidity supports are anywhere close to adequate for what's coming next.

This is a substantive episode that spans real disagreement and real depth. Pour yourself a coffee and settle in with the panel:

Tyler is the former Head of Fiscal and Economic Policy for Prime Minister Trudeau and Ministers of Finance, Chrystia Freeland and Bill Morneau. Today, he’s a Founding Partner at Meredith/Boessenkool & Phillips Policy Advisors.

Jennifer has served in senior roles in policy development and research with the Federal Government. She’s now Program Director and Associate Professor of Political Management at Carleton University.

And Ginny has spent a life in politics, most recently as Directory of Comms for Pierre Poilievre’s Conservative leadership campaign. She’s a sought after commentator across various media and a Partner at Crestview Strategy advising clients on public policy.

Thank you for joining us on #TheHerleBurly podcast. Please take a moment to give us a rating and review on iTunes, Spotify, or your favourite podcast app.

Watch episodes of The Herle Burly via Air Quotes Media on YouTube.

The sponsored ads contained in the podcast are the expressed views of the sponsor and not those of the publisher.

The Herle Burly was created by Air Quotes Media with support from our presenting sponsor TELUS, as well as CN Rail.

Greetings, you curiouser and curiouser Herle Burly-ites! David spent the weekend, like a lot of Canadians, trying to process the breakdown in Canada-US trade talks and the unusually sharp statement Mark Carney delivered to the country the day before. So he called in The Chiefs: three former chiefs of staff to some of Canada's most prominent political leaders.

It gets pointed fast.

Did the Americans overplay a genuinely greedy hand? Did Carney make the right call walking away? Was the government's credibility already damaged by how it handled the Gordie Howe Bridge file and did is show weakness the Americans noticed?

There's a real disagreement over Danielle Smith's freelancing in Washington, whether the federal government has been too closed and secretive through the negotiations, and whether the actual documents from the talks should be released publicly.

They also look ahead: what a genuine pivot away from US dependence would require, the risk to public finances if bond markets get skittish, how fast major projects could realistically move, and lastly, what all of this means for Pierre Poilievre now facing renewed questions about his leadership.

A tough, sharp, no-holds-barred conversation between three pros of very different stripes who've all sat at the highest levels of government. Not to be missed.

Enjoy the hour with:

Ian Brodie – first Chief of Staff to Stephen Harper. Now, Professor of Political Science at the University of Calgary, and Senior Advisor at New West Public Affairs.

Tim Murphy – former Chief of Staff to Paul Martin. Now, Executive Vice President and Chief Strategic Affairs Officer at AECON.

Brian Topp – former Chief of Staff to Rachel Notley in Alberta and Deputy Chief to Roy Romanow in Saskatchewan. Now, founding partner at GT&co.

Thank you for joining us on #TheHerleBurly podcast. Please take a moment to give us a rating and review on iTunes, Spotify, or your favourite podcast app.

Watch episodes of The Herle Burly via Air Quotes Media on YouTube.

The sponsored ads contained in the podcast are the expressed views of the sponsor and not those of the publisher.