In this episode, Rob Walling and Maja Voje, author of Go to Market Strategist, dive into early customer profiles (ECPs) and why they matter more than ideal customer profiles (ICPs) early on. They explore practical, scrappy marketing tactics for B2B SaaS founders and share real-world advice on customer acquisition, community building, and staying authentic while growing.

Episode Sponsor:

This podcast is brought to you by Mercury. I've been banking with Mercury for years and whenever I set up a new account, I'm reminded why traditional banking feels stuck in the past.

When our previous bank faced solvency issues, we needed to spin up new accounts quickly that could handle millions in funds across multiple businesses. Mercury had us up and running almost immediately.

I manage half a dozen different Mercury accounts across a wide range of companies – from my personal, single-member LLC to MicroConf, our 7-figure global events and education platform, to TinySeed, our venture fund and accelerator. Mercury easily handles them all.

The interface is elegantly simple for daily banking, paying invoices, and sending and receiving international wires, yet powerful enough to handle the multi-step approval processes we needed to put in place when funding founders with large transfers.

Anytime founders ask me who they should set up their accounts with, I send them to mercury.com.

Mercury is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services provided through Choice Financial Group, Column N.A., and Evolve Bank & Trust; Members FDIC.

• (3:02) – What Go-to-Market actually means for bootstrapped founders
• (7:14) – Early Customer Profile (ECP) vs. Ideal Customer Profile (ICP)
• (10:30) – Common mistakes founders make when choosing their ECP
• (13:48) – Real-world B2B SaaS examples of successful ECP launches
• (18:29) – Why GTM actions must come before GTM motions for scrappy startups
• (21:52) – Warm outreach and fishing in the right forums: practical tactics for early traction

• MicroConf Growth Retreat | London, UK - May 14-16, 2025
• Invest in TinySeed
• Maja Voje | LinkedIn
• GTM Strategist
• Go-To-Market Strategist: (Maja's book)

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you!

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Listen to Episode 773

How do you position your SaaS for success?

In episode 772, Rob Walling talks with Anthony Pierri of Fletch about a proven approach to product positioning. They discuss key lessons from 400+ startups, focusing on workflows, competitive alternatives, and why narrowing your audience matters.

• (6:59) – What is positioning, really?
• (11:16) – Why your homepage matters more than your pitch deck
• (14:17) – Workflow-based segmentation vs. firmographics
• (17:39) – Positioning against competitive alternatives
• (31:13) – The #1 mistake founders make with positioning

• MicroConf Growth Retreat | London, UK - May 14-16, 2025
• Invest in TinySeed
• Get Access to Anthony’s MicroConf New Orleans Talk
• Anthony Pierri (@anthonypierri) | LinkedIn
• Anthony Pierri (@apierriPMM) | X
• Fletch

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you!

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Can SaaS companies survive the rise of AI Agents?

In episode 771, Rob Walling is joined by Craig Hewitt to answer listener questions. They discuss the changes that happen while transitioning from a small startup to a multi-million dollar SaaS, competing against larger competitors, and maintaining startup culture as teams grow. They also share thoughts on AI agents in the SaaS space and the relevance of patents for bootstrapped businesses.

This podcast is brought to you by Mercury. I've been banking with Mercury for years and whenever I set up a new account, I'm reminded why traditional banking feels stuck in the past.

When our previous bank faced solvency issues, we needed to spin up new accounts quickly that could handle millions in funds across multiple businesses. Mercury had us up and running almost immediately.

I manage half a dozen different Mercury accounts across a wide range of companies – from my personal, single-member LLC to MicroConf, our 7-figure global events and education platform, to TinySeed, our venture fund and accelerator. Mercury easily handles them all.

The interface is elegantly simple for daily banking, paying invoices, and sending and receiving international wires, yet powerful enough to handle the multi-step approval processes we needed to put in place when funding founders with large transfers.

Anytime founders ask me who they should set up their accounts with, I send them to mercury.com.

Mercury is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services provided through Choice Financial Group, Column N.A., and Evolve Bank & Trust; Members FDIC.

• (2:41) – Marketing and sales strategies while scaling
• (9:31) – Keeping the startup culture through growth
• (14:50) – Can SaaS survive autonomous agents?
• (21:03) – AI wrapper tools
• (25:15) – Patent strategy for startups
• (29:30) – Competing against VC-backed companies

• MicroConf Remote: Early-Stage SaaS Sales
• Invest in TinySeed
• Craig Hewitt (@TheCraigHewitt) | X
• Craig Hewitt (@craighewitt.com) | Bluesky
• Rouge Startups
• Castos
• Omar Zenhom
• Omar Zenhom’s MicroConf Talk
• AI Agents vs SaaS - Who Wins the Future of Software?
• Episode 542 | 10x in Two Years, Past $3M ARR with SquadCast

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your quest...

Is it more important for entrepreneurs to focus on revenue or profit?

In episode 770, Rob Walling goes solo to explore the relationship between revenue and profit in SaaS, and the dangers of waiting for permission. He also draws inspiration from Mike Tyson’s work ethic and George Lucas’ visionary mindset to encourage entrepreneurs to push through obstacles and innovate.

• (2:41) – MRR versus ARR
• (8:04) – Don’t ask for permission, don’t give in to defeatism
• (14:38) – Inventing to pursue novel visions
• (18:48) – Mike Tyson’s training regimen
• (20:48) – You don’t need to be the best in the world

• MicroConf Growth Retreat
• Discretion Capital
• Email Einar
• Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X
• Rob Walling | LinkedIn

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you!

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Did you miss out on MicroConf US in New Orleans?

In episode 769, Rob Walling welcomes Derrick Reimer back to share highlights from MicroConf New Orleans. They dive into the event's vibrant atmosphere, standout founder talks, and the energizing mix of new and familiar faces that made this gathering in the Big Easy truly special.

• (1:40) – MicroConf New Orleans audience breakdown
• (5:50) – Upcoming MicroConf events
• (9:05) – 5 Lessons That Exits Teach Us About Running Our Business
• (12:35) – Anthony Pierri’s talk about homepage positioning
• (15:16) – 4 New Orleans excursions
• (17:17) – Talks on copywriting, pricing, and LinkedIn outreach
• (25:57) – Reviewing attendee feedback

• MicroConf Connect Applications Open Until April 9th
• MicroConf Growth Retreat
• MicroConf Europe 2025
• MicroConf Remote
• Exit Strategy by Sherry Walling, PhD & Rob Walling
• Derrick Reimer (@derrickreimer) | X
• Derrick Reimer(@derrickreimer.com) | Bluesky
• SavvyCal
• Episode 737 | Key Takeaways from MicroConf Europe 2024 (With Derrick Reimer)
• Anthony Pierri (@apierriPMM) | X
• Lianna Patch (@punchlinecopy.com) | Bluesky
• Street Pricing by Marcos Rivera
• Episode 765 | TinySeed Tales s4e9: Making the hardest decision

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you!

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Do you disagree with any of these controversial takes about bootstrapping?

In episode 768, Rob Walling unpacks a series of semi-controversial beliefs about bootstrapping from ScrapingBee’s Pierre de Wulf. Rob evaluates each point from Pierre's tweet, discussing topics like rebranding your SaaS, the hidden problem of affiliate marketing, and the realities of scaling a SaaS business.

• (1:21) – Pierre’s semi-controversial bootstrapping beliefs
• (4:35) – Don’t waste time on a rebrand
• (7:24) – No one cares about your domain extension
• (9:06) – Affiliate marketing won’t fix your acquisition issues
• (11:51) – There is no silver bullet for growth
• (13:42) – Copy what works best
• (14:59) – Double down on acquisition channels that work
• (16:53) – Hire specialists
• (19:34) – Never offer a plan with unlimited features
• (20:22) – Don’t offer a cheap plan if you can’t support it
• (20:47) – Don’t add social logins to your signup page
• (21:27) – Read competitors’ reviews several times a year
• (21:59) – $10k MRR doesn’t guarantee $100k MRR
• (22:28) – You will get copied if you share success
• (23:02) – “Build this feature…”
• (24:10) – The Mom Test
• (24:56) – Provide value for your target demographic for free
• (25:47) – Don’t overthink Product Hunt
• (26:00) – You’ll never sell your SaaS for 10x

• MicroConf Growth Retreat in London
• Rob Walling (@robwalling) | X
• Pierre de Wulf (@PierreDeWulf) | X
• ScrapingBee (@ScrapingBee) | X
• ScrapingBee
• Pierre’s semi-controversial bootstrapping beliefs
• TinySeed
• Rob Walling.com
• Rob Walling | LinkedIn
• SaaS Institute
• Exit Strategy by Sherry Walling, PhD & Rob Walling
• Episode 705 | From Bootstrapped to Mostly Bootstrapped to Venture Backed
• The Mom Test by Rob Fitzpatrick
• Deploy Empathy by Michele Hansen
• The SaaS Playbook by Rob Walling

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your questi...

Is product management more of an art, or a science?

In episode 767, Rob Walling is joined again by Brendan Fortune to answer listener questions focused on product management. They discuss identifying your ideal customer profile, prioritizing feature requests, and positioning against competitors. They also weigh in on how product managers should focus their time.

• (2:50) – Is your ideal customer always your highest paying one?
• (8:11) – Finding just one ICP can be difficult
• (14:56) – How do you prioritize feature requests?
• (19:24) – Product management is art and science
• (26:02) – Competing with competitors on value, not price
• (32:21) – How should product managers focus their time?
• (37:20) – How do PMs manage roadmaps and user feedback?

• Invest in TinySeed
• MicroConf Mastermind Applications close March 31st
• MicroConf Growth Retreat
• The SaaS Playbook
• Brendan Fortune | LinkedIn
• Customer.io
• Episode 756 | Why Great Product Management Is Critical for Your Startup
• Product Flywheel + Pricing + Org Strategy (Miro)
• Savio

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you!

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How do you achieve both success and longevity in SaaS?

In episode 766, Rob chats with Steli Efti about growing Close.com to over $40 million in ARR. Steli shares insights into the importance of maintaining strong co-founder relationships over 12 years, navigating crises, and the importance of emotional resilience in entrepreneurship. They also dive into Close's recent pricing shift to introduce a lower entry-level plan.

• (2:08) – Reflecting on 12 years of SaaS at Close
• (3:50) – Strong co-founder relationships
• (11:24) – Longevity and consistently showing up
• (20:23) – Surviving moments of crisis
• (29:27) – Launching a more affordable pricing tier
• (34:40) – Getting back into the content game

• Exit Strategy by Sherry Walling, PhD & Rob Walling
• Close
• Close Sales Guides
• Episode 498 | Selling During a Pandemic with Steli Efti
• The 0 to $30 Million Blueprint
• Steli Efti (@Steli) | X
• Steli Efti | LinkedIn

If you have questions about starting or scaling a software business that you’d like for us to cover, please submit your question for an upcoming episode. We’d love to hear from you!

Subscribe & Review: iTunes | Spotify