How do Christian leaders navigate deep church conflict, avoid the trap of self-deception, and sustain genuine joy over a lifetime of ministry?

In this episode, host Mark sits down with retired Baptist pastor, author, and former national Ministry Advisor Andrew Rollinson. Drawing from over 40 years of pastoral leadership—from early mission work in Uganda to pastoring in Newcastle, Morningside, and St Andrews—Andrew shares battle-tested wisdom on what it takes to do Christ's work in Christ's ways.

Together, they explore the core themes of Andrew’s book, Conversations by the Sea, focusing on the vital importance of emotional self-awareness, non-anxious leadership, and establishing robust accountability in ministry.

Key Takeaways & Topics Covered:

• Navigating Church Conflict: Why conflict isn't always morally negative, how to build trust, and the creation of "Peaceful Transformation Teams" using Anabaptist Bridgebuilders principles.
• Leading as a Non-Anxious Presence: The power of doing the basics well, listening before leading, and avoiding power-driven decision-making.
• Finding Power in Weakness: How tragic and dark moments in ministry reveal God’s grace and shape pastoral collegiality.
• Theology as Worship: Why reading deep, challenging theology enriches daily pastoral care and guards against "hurry sickness."
• Self-Awareness vs. Self-Deception: Why self-awareness and security in God are the two most critical traits for leaders, and how to spot our own blind spots.
• Authentic Accountability: Moving beyond surface-level accountability to intentional annual reviews, counseling, and invites for candid feedback.

Books & Resources Mentioned:

• Conversations by the Sea by Andrew Rollinson
• The Undefended Leader trilogy by Simon Walker
• When Narcissism Comes to Church by Chuck DeGroat
• I Told Me So: Self-Deception and the Christian Life by Gregg A. Ten Elshof

About Oak Hill College & Jesus Work in Jesus Ways

Jesus Work in Jesus Ways is a podcast by Oak Hill College, created to equip pastors, church leaders, and believers to serve Christ with his heart, wisdom, and character.

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