INTRO

Ten episodes in, and the Pages Podcast is entering its penultimate stretch. After spending the last several episodes climbing the character hierarchy — from mains to backgrounds — Bee shifts the lens to something more intimate: how characters are built, what they mean, and what role they play in the larger story. Today's territory covers stock characters, symbolic characters, and the trifecta of narrative roles — protagonist, antagonist, and deuteragonist. Buckle up.

PART A — Character Classification Based on Level of Development

Rita opens with a crisp recap of everything covered so far — dynamic vs. static, flat vs. round — before Bee introduces two concepts that don't often make it into casual storytelling conversations: stock and symbolic characters. From the "dumb blonde" to the "angry Black woman," stock characters are the archetypes pulled straight from a cultural stockpile. Familiar. Predictable. And more powerful than you'd think.

PART B — Symbolic Characters

This is where things get uncomfortably personal. BoJack isn't just a sad horse — he's a walking symbol of unprocessed childhood trauma. Mr. Peanut Butter? Not as cheerful as he looks — he's the poster child for people-pleasing and emotional avoidance. Princess Carolyn is workaholic self-sacrifice dressed in a power suit. Diane is overthinking and self-righteousness slowly caving in on itself. And Todd? He's every person who ever asked, "why can't I just play video games all day?" Bee breaks them all down and lands on a single confronting question: what combination of these flawed symbols makes up your own fatal flaw?

PART C — QUIZ

Theory meets chaos. Bee puts Rita on the spot with quotes pulled directly from the show, and Rita's guesses are — let's just say — entertainingly wrong in the most revealing ways. The quiz isn't just fun and games; it proves that the characters of BoJack Horseman are so well-defined, their out-of-character moments hit harder than anything else in the series.

PART D — Character Classification Based on Roles: The Protagonist

Main character and protagonist — not the same thing. Bee draws the line clearly, tracing the word back to ancient Greek theater before grounding it in a modern reality: the protagonist is the one whose goals build the plot, whose journey we follow most closely, and who has the most at stake. BoJack checks every box. But what happens when the protagonist is also his own worst enemy?

PART E — The Antagonist

Spoiler: the villain and the antagonist are not interchangeable. From Batman opposing the Joker in his own story, to the tsunami in The Impossible, to the toxic seniors Bee still can't forget from high school — antagonists come in all shapes. In BoJack's world, the greatest opposition to BoJack Horseman... is BoJack Horseman.

PART F — The Deuteragonist

Second actor. Sidekick. Confidant. Love interest. The deuteragonist wears many hats, and BoJack's cast is full of them — each one orbiting his chaos in a different orbit, giving more than they receive, until they can't anymore. Todd, Princess Carolyn, Diane — all deuteragonists, all indispensable, all eventually forced to choose themselves.

CONCLUSION & OUTRO

A pin goes in. The roles discussion continues next episode — the season finale — where allies become foils and the full cast of BoJack's life finally gets their reckoning. See you on the next page.

SUMMARY NOTE:

Recap & Intro:

Rita's dreamy vision of main character energy meets the harsh reality that the TikTok trend didn't age well. Betty recaps the five levels of character hierarchy and drops the episode's anchor quote from Timothy Kurek: "Sometimes you can find healing by playing a supporting role in someoneelse's experience."

After last episode's spotlight on main characters, Bettydescends the ladder. Two teasers set the stage: a nameless One-Piece spectator whose single question ignited the Great Pirate Era, and a jogging baboon in BoJack Horseman who delivered the show's most iconic life advice without evergetting a name.

PART A — Main Supporting Characters

Rita learns a devastating truth: concert fans aren't supporting characters — they're background characters. "No name, no face — they copy and paste us." The Gladiator comparison drives it home. Betty redefines "supporting character" as someone who occupies a significant part of the main character's living identity — not someone who literally supports them. Real-life parallels reveal hierarchy is fluid:parents, rivals, and roommates all shift ranks. The BoJack deep dive maps every major relationship — Mr. Peanutbutter's climb, Diane's evolution, Princess Carolyn's tragic pattern of being everyone else's supporting character while neglecting her own story, and Todd's journey from housemate to best friend. Betty's original quote: "Sometimes losing relevance in someone's story meansgaining significance in yours."

PART B — Side Supporting Characters

Side characters explained through a brilliant analogy: yoursister's best friends are main supporting characters for her, but only side characters for you. BoJack examples stack up — Pickles, Guy, Judah, Rutabaga Rabitowitz.

PART C — Understanding Tertiary & BackgroundCharacters

The Cabbage Man from Avatar survived an entire war and built a corporate empire. Rita: "A cockroach." Then the episode's most electrifying moment — the unnamed man at Gold Roger's execution in One Piece whose single question launched 1,000+ episodes. Nobody remembers his face, buteveryone remembers what he did.

PART D — The Surprising Use of Tertiary & BackgroundCharacters

Formal definitions with BoJack examples: Neil McBeal, Tom Jumbo-Grumbo, Angela Diaz, Hollyhock's eight dads. Background characters get their due — the baboon's "It gets easier" quote, animal gags, and celebrity spoofs like Jurj Clooners and Cindy Crawfish. The sad truth: background characters often exist just to die — nameless and replaceable.

CONCLUSION

Betty's parting wisdom: "Before you fight another man's battle, ask yourself — how much does this man really know about me? Otherwise, you risk becoming just another nameless figure in a war that mattered more than your own life."

Rita: "Use main character energy in moderation. Touchgrass. Love yourself first."

OUTRO

Next: characterization by level of development, then by role— where protagonist vs. main character finally gets untangled. "When astoryteller writes with intentionality, no character is just an extra."

Full Show Notes:

For chapter-by-chapter summaries, referenced Scriptures, and reflection questions, check out the full show notes, full transcripts and research references for this episode →https://www.pagespodcasthq.com/e/the-indispensable-others/

SUMMARY NOTE:

Recap & Intro:

Quick recap of the series so far: character development isthe "cooking phase" that brings complexity and depth together. We explored realism and relatability as the two hallmarks of authentic characters as shown in Princess Carolyn's final convesation with Bojack at the final episode

Today marks a major shift from character design to charactercategorization. We're exploring four classification systems:

• by hierarchy,
• by development,
• by role, and
• by archetype.

This episode focuses on hierarchy—the order of character importance—and we're using the infamous 2020 "Main Character Energy" trend to understand what truly makes someone the center of a story.

PART A: The Main Character Energy Discuss & Characterisation in Storytelling

The viral TikTok trend that exploded during COVID lockdownencouraged people to "romanticize their lives" and see themselves as the main character. By 2025, the trend morphed from empowerment to narcissism. But here's the twist: while it became toxic, it reveals something profound about storytelling. The core message was actually valid—we ARE the main characters in our own life stories, experiencing reality from our limited perspective.

PART B: Characterization by Hierarchy

Betty breaks down the five-level hierarchy system:

1. main character,
2. main supporting character,
3. side supporting character,
4. tertiary characters, and
5. background extras.

In BoJack Horseman, the hierarchy is clear—the show literally starts and ends with BoJack.

The Philosophy: We each live in our own miniature world where we're the constant centerpiece. Even ants are main characters in their own stories—humans are just background elements to them. Timothy Kurek's quote resonates:

"Sometimes you can find healing by playing a supportingrole in someone else's experience."

PART C: Considering The Main Character

K.M. Weiland's principle: Character wins over plot because without character, there is no plot.

Two crucial definitions emerge:

Traditional: The character with most screen time, present at conflict's beginning, central at climax, key to resolution.

Dan Brown's revelation: The main character could be the hero, narrator, best friend, or even the villain—but they must be unforgettable and intertwined with the storyline.

Mind-bending examples:

Bridgertion: not the Bridgertons but Lady Whistledown

Akame ga Kill: not Tatsumi, the first protagonist but Akame

Game of Thrones: Multiple protagonists but not the house of Starks are the MCs.

CONCLUSION:

The ultimate test: When a main character dies, the story ends. If they die and the narrative continues, you've identified the wrong MC.

This is why BoJack survived his drowning in "The View from Halfway Down"—death would be an easy escape. His story required him to live with consequences.

OUTRO:

Next episode: Supporting characters and those moments when even main characters play second fiddle in someone else's story.

For detailed show note, check out the link:https://www.pagespodcasthq.com/e/part-a-characterisation-by-hierarchy-12-%e2%80%93-why-the-main-character-is-probably-a-scam/