In this episode, Devon O’Rourke, founder of Fluvio, shares why the push for ultra-simple messaging can actually hurt your credibility with technical buyers.

We discuss:

1. Whether Gen AI is a strategic utility or a threat to deep thinking in product marketing

2. Why the trend of simplistic messaging is a danger zone for sophisticated tech products

3. Why it’s dangerous to solely rely on templates for product marketing activities

4. Why LinkedIn influencers could be guiding you down the wrong path

5. What makes a great product marketer

6. Why go-to-market should be treated as a cyclical, always-on engine rather than a one-time launch event

#productmarketing #messaging #b2bmarketing #saasmarketing #marketingstrategy

Chapters:

(00:00) Intro

(00:42) Devon’s perspective on Gen-AI: Is it helpful or harmful?

(03:57) Lessons from Amazon’s writing culture and the "PR FAQ"

(07:09) How Fluvio uses custom GPTs for research and business development

(11:07) The Danger Zone: Why simple messaging isn't always effective messaging

(16:21) Escaping the competitive herd and finding your unique voice

(19:06) The risk of reducing strategic PMM work to rigid templates

(27:42) Defining the traits that separate a "good" PMM from a "great" one

(34:58) Understanding Fluvio’s cyclical "always-on" go-to-market engine

(41:14) The founding story of Fluvio and building a senior PMM consultancy

(50:59) Where to find Devon and Fluvio online

My biggest takeaways:

Where to find Devon:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/devon-o-rourke-54028b34/

• Website: https://www.fluviomarketing.com/

Where to find Josh:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshua-chronister/

• Newsletter: https://onmessaging.substack.com/

• All On Messaging episodes: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLvzzQNjT_hfzRg4xGgHIqcOab9AdXxnpX&si=fhS4k_GINBvYOiai

Resources mentioned:

• Books: Different: Escaping the Competitive Herd by Youngme Moon, Shoe Dog by Phil Knight, The Everything Store by Brad Stone.

• Tools: ChatGPT (Custom GPTs), Windmill (AI Management Tool).

• People: Liza Adams (Fractional CMO & AI Advisor).

Subscribe to On Messaging:

Subscribe, like, and share if you’re a product marketer crafting messaging in B2B SaaS. New episodes drop every other week 💛

For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email josh@onmessaging.com.

Episode Summary

Product marketers are masters at positioning products, but we often struggle to apply those same skills to their own careers.

In this episode, product marketing career coach Yi Lin Pei shares her framework for self-positioning and career differentiation.

Yi Lin breaks down the concrete steps to shift from a tactical executor to a strategic growth driver, how to evolve your personal messaging to command executive presence, and why the most important communication skill might be asking "why" before saying "yes".

Key Takeaways

• Position Yourself Like a Product: Apply PMM principles to your career. First, define your "destination" (where you want to go and who you want to be). Second, understand why your "target companies" would care about and value you.

• Shift from Executor to Growth Driver: To make this leap, you must first be exceptional at your foundational skills, like creating messaging that is human and differentiated. Then, focus on building cross-functional influence and thinking like a business strategist by tying your work directly to the company's P&L and growth levers.

• Evolve Your Language for Leadership: To gain executive presence, you must change your language. Shift from talking about "tasks" and "projects" to discussing "programs," "processes," and "playbooks" that you are building to be scalable for the future.

• Master the "T-Shaped" Framework: A "T-shaped" PMM has a broad range of expertise across core functions (research, positioning, launches, enablement) but also develops a deep, indispensable specialty in one or two areas, such as competitive intelligence or domain expertise in a technical field like cybersecurity.

• Tell Your Story (to a 5-Year-Old): If you struggle to tell your own career story, Yi Lin suggests practicing as if you're explaining it to a five-year-old. This forces you to simplify, cut to the chase, and focus on the "why" behind your decisions, which is far more compelling than the "what".

• Use a Consultative Approach: When pitching an idea to leadership, don't just present one option. Instead, offer 2-3 potential options, present a data-backed analysis of the ROI for each, and then give your recommendation. This changes the question from "Should we support this?" to "Which option should we support?".

• The Power of Asking "Why": When a manager gives you an urgent, out-of-left-field request, pause before reacting. Instead of saying yes or no, ask questions to understand the "why" behind the ask. This diffuses defensiveness, builds curiosity, and often reveals the true priority (or that the request isn't the right one).

Chapters

• (00:37) Why Yi Lin chose career coaching after a 2020 layoff

• (04:40) How leaders can make others comfortable coming to them for advice

• (07:59) Applying PMM principles (positioning & differentiation) to your own career

• (14:47) The 3-step process to shift from a tactical executor to a strategic growth driver

• (19:06) How to balance day-to-day tactical work with long-term strategic efforts

• (23:31) Defining the "T-shaped" product marketer

• (26:39) The importance of domain experience (and when broad experience is an advantage)

• (30:55) A simple exercise for PMMs to apply storytelling to their own accomplishments

• (33:12) Tactics to evolve your personal messaging for leadership and executive presence

• (40:22) The single most important communication skill for handling urgent requests

• (44:22) Yi Lin's answer to "What is living all about?"

About Yi Lin

Yi Lin Pei is a product marketing consultant and career coach who helps product marketers grow in their careers and advises companies on building strong teams.

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/yilinpei/
  

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