Marilyn McEntyre says long sentences demand more of us. They slow us down and open us up.

“It prevents us from leaping to conclusions, though it invites us to consider possibilities. it schools us in the very patience it demands.”

“The Trees of Eleanor,” by Megan Willome

• Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, by Marilyn McIntyre
• Don Quixote, by Miguel de Cervantes
• Middlemarch, by George Eliot
• Moby Dick, by Herman Melville
• always Flannery

• Megan: Moby Dick, by Herman Melville
• Callie:
• Tresta: Uprooted, by Grace Olmstead

Visit us at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to read the revised essays from each episode, find links to each of our websites, and more.

Today, Megan and Callie are interviewing Tresta to discuss the journey of writing her debut book More Beautiful Than Necessary: Finding God's Goodness in a Life Beyond My Control. We are exploring themes of grief, beauty, and trust in God's goodness even in the middle of life's uncertainties, as well as discussing the process of crafting a memoir that embraces mystery and the messiness of life.

Join us on Substack at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to watch the video version of this episode, and to find links to our work.

Tresta's book is available here:

Callie starts off our episode on Sharing Stories with this gem:

"Stories are how I breathe, how I live, everything I think, everything I do. As long as I have a story for it, I can keep going."

McEntyre says stories equip us for living and even for survival.

“At their best, if they are doing what they are meant to do, stories take us places we might not otherwise consent to go.”

Join us as we discuss the stories we share through literature and around the table with family, and the ways story complicates and enriches our lives.

Trouble Seat:

“Our Shared Language,” by Tresta Payne

Mentions in this episode:

• Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, by Marilyn McIntyre
• Peace Like a River, by Leif Enger
• Theo of Golden, by Allen Levi
• the Twilight series, by Stephenie Meyer
• always Flannery
• Tresta’s essay “Sometimes He Gives Scars”, at Cultivating Oaks Press

What we’re reading:

• Megan: Moby Dick, by Herman Melville
• Callie: Dress Your Family in Corduroy and Denim, by David Sedaris
• Tresta: Uprooted by Gracie Olmstead

Visit us at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to read the revised essays from each episode, find links to each of our websites, and more.

McEntyre calls conversation “an exchange of gifts.”

“We come into one another’s presence bearing whatever harvest of experience the day has offered, and we foster relationship by making a gift of what we have received.”

This episode is all about the art of staying in conversation, the power of dialogue, and how meaningful exchanges can build community and foster self-awareness. Join us as we discuss insights from Marilyn McIntyre's Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, plus some practical tips for writers and conversationalists.

Trouble Seat:

“Stay in Conversation,” by Callie Feyen

Mentions in this episode:

• Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, by Marilyn McIntyre
• Everything is Copy, a film about Nora Ephron, title from one of her most famous quotes
• Friendship in the Lord, by Fr. Paul Hinnebusch
• When We Swung from Church Bells, by Callie Feyen
• Flannery O’Connor: everything she ever wrote

What we’re reading:

• Megan: Terms of Endearment, by Larry McMurtry
• Callie: Middlemarch, by George Eliot (Book Two: “Old and Young” Essentialism, by Greg McKeown
• Tresta: Galahad and the Grail by Malcolm Guite

Visit us at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to read the revised essays from each episode, find links to each of our websites, and more.

We dubbed this episode "Slow Reading", and in it we discuss the art of reading well, the importance of community in reading, and practical strategies for deepening our engagement with books and poetry. We share some of our personal practices and note-taking methods, and we talk about how reading influences our writing and spiritual growth.

McEntyre invites us to enter a text, eat it, and breathe it.

“If you’re reading slowly, listening to be addressed, one word or another will summon you. Those are the places where, instead of going on, you go in. You pause. you do that countercultural thing you can’t do at the movies: you stop.”

Trouble Seat:

“A Little Lectio,” by Megan Willome

Mentions in this episode:

• Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, by Marilyn McIntyre
• The Red House Mystery by A.A. Milne (yes, you read that correctly, he of Pooh fame)

What we’re reading:

• Megan: Bea Wolf, by Zach Weinersmith, art by Boulet
• Callie: Dress Your Family in Corduroy and Denim David Sedaris
• Tresta: Galahad and the Grail by Malcolm Guite

Visit us at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to read the revised essays from each episode, find links to each of our websites, and more.

In this episode, we explore the importance of honesty, trust, and boundaries in life and writing, inspired by Marilyn McEntyre's insights on truth telling and the power of metaphor. We also get a little glimpse into Tresta's forthcoming book 'More Beautiful Than Necessary: Finding God's Goodness in a Life Beyond My Control', releasing October 14, 2026.

McEntyre offers questions to pose about our news sources, including:

“Who is framing the questions? What questions are conspicuously not being addressed—or being consigned to a back page, or a subordinate clause? Who is selecting? Sequencing? Explaining?”

Trouble Seat:

“April Fool,” by Callie Feyen

Mentions in this episode:

• Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, by Marilyn McIntyre
• The Geography of Memory: A Pilgrimage Through Alzheimer’s, by Jeanne Murray Walker

What we’re reading:

• Megan: Stella Maris by Cormac McCarthy
• Callie: Prodigal Summer by Barbara Kingsolver
• Tresta: Life, and Death, and Giants by Ron Rindo

Visit us at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to read the revised essays from each episode, find links to each of our websites, and more.

In this episode we explore Marilyn McEntyre's insights on truth, the craft of writing, and the importance of honesty and humility in storytelling. Callie expounds on the value of scene and reflection, and we give practical tips for writers seeking authenticity.

McEntyre offers a list of distinguishing characteristics of truth, including:

“Truth is not two-sided; it’s many-sided.

Truth burrows in the body.

Truth flickers.”

Trouble Seat:

“Sorting Truth,” by Tresta Payne

Mentions in this episode:

• Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, by Marilyn McIntyre
• Wilfrid Gordon McDonald Partridge, by Mem Fox
• The Daily Poem podcast

What we’re reading:

• Megan: Lonesome Dove
• Callie: Amy and Isabelle by Elizabeth Strout
• Tresta: The Anthropocene Reviewed by John Green

Visit us at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to read the revised essays from each episode, find links to each of our websites, and more.

In this episode, Megan, Callie, and Tresta explore Marilyn McEntyre's book 'Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies,' emphasizing the importance of loving words, slow reflection, and the stewardship of language in our lives. They share insights on how reading, writing, and silence deepen our understanding and connection.

“We care for words when we use them thankfully, recognizing in each kind a specific gift borne in the mother tongue, bestowed at birth as a legacy from the Word who was in the beginning.”

~Marilyn McEntyre

Mentions in this episode:

• Caring for Words in a Culture of Lies, by Marilyn McIntyre
• Still: notes on a mid-faith crisis, by Lauren Winner
• The Crossover, by Kwame Alexander
• Love & other Mysteries, by Megan Willome
• Emma M. Lion series, by Beth Brower
• History of the Rain, by Niall Williams

What we’re reading:

• Megan: History of the Rain, by Niall Williams
• Callie: On Writing by Stephen King; Middlemarch, by George Eliot Book One: Miss Brooke
• Tresta: The Unselected Journals of Emma M. Lion, Vol. 8 by Beth Brower

Trouble Seat:

All three of us! Pleased to meet you.

Visit us at https://necessarytroublepodcast.substack.com/ to read the revised essays from each episode, find links to each of our websites, and more.