What if “we learn from our mistakes” is only half true?

In this episode of Coaching the Whole Educator, Becca Silver talks with Dr. Doug Fisher, professor and chair of educational leadership at San Diego State University and a teacher leader at Health Sciences High and Middle College, about success-oriented learning and what it means for instructional coaching.

We’ve all heard that mistakes are opportunities for learning. But making a mistake doesn’t automatically mean we learn from it. And when failures keep piling up, especially in a public space like a classroom, students can become discouraged, disengaged, and less willing to try.

Doug shares why experiencing success matters for learning, motivation, and confidence, and how his school is putting that into practice. Through incremental success criteria, teachers chunk each hour of class into at least four checkpoints, giving students frequent opportunities to recognize their progress and experience success. What started in ninth grade a couple of years ago is now school-wide.

Then Becca and Doug turn the conversation to instructional coaching.

Full-cycle coaching (pre-observation, observation, debrief) has its place. But when it’s the only model a school uses, coaches run out of time to support the range of teachers, it can feel like evaluation when a leader runs it, and it reduces how often coaches are in classrooms.

Doug introduces two alternatives: short-cycle (goal-driven) coaching, built around a shared goal over two to four weeks, and micro-coaching, including his Notice → Name → Nudge approach for helping teachers recognize what they’re doing well and consider a small next step.

Becca makes the case that walkthrough forms are a data tool, not a coaching tool. When every visit turns into a laundry list, teachers walk away feeling like they’re never doing enough. And when teachers are stuck, experiencing resistance, or facing a lot to change, another full coaching cycle is often the opposite of what they need. The place to start is small, quick wins.

Because recognizing what needs to change is one thing. Believing you can change it is another.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

• Why learning from mistakes isn’t enough, and how small successes help build confidence and momentum
• What the Eighty Five Percent Rule suggests about balancing challenge and success
• How incremental success criteria create frequent opportunities for students to recognize progress
• How remembering previous successes can support persistence with challenging tasks
• The differences between full-cycle, short-cycle, and micro-coaching
• How to use Notice → Name → Nudge to offer focused feedback without overwhelming teachers
• Why walkthrough forms shouldn’t be your default tool for every coaching conversation
• How frequent peer observations can help build a culture of coaching
• Why collective efficacy depends on experiencing success, not team building

Who this episode is for:
Instructional coaches, teacher leaders, principals, and district leaders who want practical coaching approaches that build teacher efficacy, treat resistance as information, and help educators experience meaningful progress.

Resources mentioned:

• The Art and Science of Teacher Coaching by Douglas Fisher, Nancy Frey, John Almarode, and Toni Osborn Faddis (Corwin, 2026)
• Fisher and Frey: fisherandfrey.com
• Connect with Doug Fisher on LinkedIn: Douglas Fisher
• The Eighty Five Percent Rule for Optimal Learning (Wilson et al., 2019, Nature Communications)

Related research:

• Not Learning From Failure: The Greatest Failure of All (Eskreis-Winkler & Fishbach, 2019, Psychological Science)

Keep the conversation going:

• Get The Resistance Solution by Becca Silver: https://amzn.to/4pRCaa5
• Lead your team through it with Book Study Facilitator Training: https://www.thewholeeducator.com/book-study-facilitator-training

Let's Stay Connected!
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Episode Summary

What if the scripted curriculum we hand new teachers is the very thing burning them out? In this episode of Coaching the Whole Educator, Becca Silver talks with Bob Lenz, CEO of PBLWorks, about how project-based learning (PBL) helps early career teachers thrive instead of just surviving, and why school systems built for consistency keep pulling innovative teachers back into compliance.

Bob shares findings from a randomized controlled trial of the Knowledge in Action AP curriculum, where PBL students outscored peers on AP exams by 8% in year one and 10% in year two, across all demographics. He explains why teachers trained in student-centered schools often revert to traditional instruction within three years of moving to a traditional school, and why giving new teachers high-quality PBL curriculum acts as a “floor,” not a script. Becca connects the conversation to her resistance work, naming the compliance culture that shapes how we treat both students and adults.

In this episode, you’ll learn:

• Why the portrait of a graduate works as a “Trojan horse” for deeper learning and PBL adoption
• The biggest gap between teacher prep programs and day one in the classroom
• How PBL partner districts improved chronic absenteeism (one middle school went from 66% to 96% attendance)
• The four areas leaders need to address for systemwide PBL: vision, conditions, professional learning, and measurement
• Why “two projects a year” is a realistic starting point for reluctant departments
• How making expert thinking visible builds new teacher agency and confidence
• Why PBL is an equity issue, and why it may be less “innovation” than overdue updating

Who this episode is for: instructional coaches, principals, district leaders, and teacher leaders supporting new teachers, implementing project-based learning, or working to reduce teacher burnout and turnover.

Frequently asked questions

Does project-based learning improve test scores? According to Bob, a randomized controlled study validated by USC found PBL students scored 8 to 10% higher on AP exams than students in traditional classes, with strong gains in critical thinking and communication.

How can schools support new teachers with PBL? Pair high-quality, student-centered curriculum with embedded professional learning and coaching, so new teachers start from a strong floor instead of designing units from scratch on Sunday night.

Why do innovative teaching practices fade? When school policies, pacing, and observation practices conflict with student-centered goals, teachers drift back to compliance-based instruction. Leaders have to surface those conflicts and build a coherent system.

Timestamps

• 00:00 Welcome and introduction to Bob Lenz
• 00:58 What PBLWorks does and why agency matters
• 01:50 Portrait of a graduate as a path to PBL
• 05:10 Helping new teachers thrive, not survive
• 06:40 The AP study results
• 10:10 Curriculum as a floor and giving Sundays back to teachers
• 12:55 The gap between teacher prep and day one
• 15:00 Compliance curriculum, burnout, and attendance gains
• 16:20 Compliance culture and resistance
• 17:00 Schools built for consistency, not innovation
• 19:30 Moving the whole system: what leaders need in place
• 24:00 Agency, professional judgment, and making thinking visible
• 27:30 Innovation or overdue update?
• 29:20 PBL as an equity floor
• 30:20 Bob’s new book and resources

Resources mentioned

• PBLWorks: pblworks.org
• PBL for All: A Leader’s Guide by Bob Lenz and Lisa Morales
• PBL World coaching academy (June, Napa Valley)

Keep going

• Get The Resistance Solution: https://amzn.to/4pRCaa5
• Lead your team through it with Book Study Facilitator Training: https://www.thewholeeducator.com/book-study-facilitator-training

Let's Stay Connected!
www.thewholeeducator.com | info@thewholeeducator.com

You've modeled it, co-planned it, and practiced it side by side, and it's still not showing up in the classroom. In this Resistance Solution Mini-Session, Becca Silver reads from Chapter 2 of The Resistance Solution on why more PD and more modeling often miss the mark. Coaches and school leaders get one question to ask before their next coaching move.

In this episode:

• Why resistance often looks like a skill problem on the surface
• The quiet calculation teachers run before trying something new: Is this worth it? What if it doesn't work? Can I pull this off?
• Why a fourth round of modeling rarely fixes a will gap

This week's challenge: pick the coaching conversation that keeps looping and ask yourself, "Is this a gap in skill, or a gap in will?" If it's will, swap your next model for a question.

Take the free quiz, What Is Resistance Costing You?: https://www.thewholeeducator.com/resistance-quiz

Get The Resistance Solution: https://amzn.to/4pRCaa5

Free reader tools: thewholeeducator.com/book-resources

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