After more than a decade of companies pouring money, technology, and consultants into customer experience, US customer satisfaction sits almost exactly where it did in 2013. Flat. Now AI arrives as the promised cavalry — and leaders are racing to bolt it onto everything before they understand what they're actually trying to fix.

In this episode, Colin and Ryan separate the smart play from the slow-motion mistake. "AI-first" is sound management: if AI delivers a better, faster, or cheaper experience than a human, use it. But "AI-only" — AI sprinkled over everything like fairy dust because leaders are terrified of being left behind — is where companies quietly automate themselves into a commodity and erode the one thing they can't easily win back: trust.

Using the now-infamous "microwave test" (brilliant for the peas, a disaster for the steak), Colin and Ryan dig into why so much CX investment has produced so little, and why the companies that win the next decade won't be the ones that adopted AI fastest — but the ones who knew exactly what they wanted it to do.

• Why is a tool used without a strategy just an expensive way to make a bad experience happen faster

• The critical difference between "AI-first" (smart) and "AI-only" (reckless) — and how to tell which one you're actually doing

• The one question almost no organization can answer — and why you can't deploy AI well until you can

• How over-reliance on AI quietly costs you on two fronts: differentiation (the same prediction machine is available to every competitor) and trust (the moment customers feel they have to double-check you, you've lost)

• A simple, strategy-first decision framework for where AI lifts the experience and where a human still wins

The companies that win the next decade won't be the ones that adopted AI fastest. They'll be the ones who knew exactly what they wanted it to do — and never lost sight of the most important thing: the customer's experience.

• US customer satisfaction flat since 2013 — American Customer Satisfaction Index

• Research on cognitive offloading and weakening judgment — Societies, 2025

Colin Shaw is a LinkedIn 'Top Voice' with a massive 286,000 followers and 87,000 subscribers to his 'Why Customers Buy' newsletter. Shaw is named one of the world's 'Top 150 Business Influencers' by LinkedIn. His company, Beyond Philosophy LLC, has been selected four times by the Financial Times as a top management consultancy. Shaw is co-host of the top 1.5% podcast 'The Intuitive Customer'—with over 600,000 downloads—and author of eight best-sellers on customer experience. Shaw is a sought-after keynote speaker. Follow Colin on LinkedIn.

Ryan Hamilton is a Professor of Marketing at Emory University's Goizueta Business School and co-author of 'The Intuitive Customer' book. An award-winning teacher and researcher in consumer psychology, he has been named one of Poets & Quants' "World's Best 40 B-School Profs Under 40." His research focuses on how brands, prices, and choice architecture influence shopper decision-making, and his findings have been published in top academic journals and covered by major media outlets like The New York Times and CNN. His work highlights how psychology can help firms better understand and serve their customers. Ryan has a new book, "The Growth Dilemma: Managing Your Brand When Different Customers Want Different Things," Harvard Business Press. Follow Ryan on LinkedIn.

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Summary

Artificial Intelligence is transforming marketing faster than almost any technology before it. Brands can now create professional-quality advertisements in hours rather than months and at a fraction of the cost. But as AI-generated creative becomes more common, an important question is emerging: Are brands becoming more efficient while losing some of the humanity that customers value?

In this episode, Ben Shaw and Professor Ryan Hamilton explore the growing use of AI in advertising and marketing. They discuss why customers may care less about how cheaply content is produced and more about whether it feels authentic, trustworthy, and emotionally engaging. They also examine why AI may unintentionally create a flood of mediocre content, why consumers often value effort and craftsmanship, and how marketers can use AI without sacrificing what makes their brands distinctive.

The discussion reveals that while AI is a powerful tool, it is not a substitute for customer understanding, emotional insight, or great strategy.

Best Quote from the Episode:

"The companies that win won't be the ones using the most AI. They'll be the ones using AI without losing their humanity."

Ben Shaw

Key Takeaways:

• Customers don't buy efficiency—they buy value, trust, and emotional connection.

• AI-generated advertising may lower production costs, but it can also reduce perceived authenticity.

• Consumers often use effort and craftsmanship as signals of quality and credibility.

• As AI-generated content becomes widespread, "realness" may become an increasingly valuable differentiator.

• Unlimited AI revisions can lead to creative dilution and "death by a thousand prompts."

• AI won't fix poor marketing strategy; it simply allows marketers to produce more content faster.

• Great marketing still comes from human insight, emotion, creativity, and understanding customer needs.

• The most successful brands will use AI as a tool, not as a replacement for strategic thinking.

Why You Should Listen:

If you're a marketer, business leader, customer experience professional, or simply curious about how AI is changing the relationship between brands and customers, this episode offers a balanced and practical perspective. You'll learn where AI genuinely creates value, where it creates risks, and why authenticity may become one of the most important competitive advantages in the years ahead.

Resources Mentioned

• Ben Shaw - https://www.linkedin.com/in/benshawuk/

• Professor Ryan Hamilton - http://linkedin.com/in/ryan-hamilton-49b3321

About the Hosts:

Ryan Hamilton is a Professor of Marketing at Emory University's Goizueta Business School and co-author of 'The Intuitive Customer' book. An award-winning teacher and researcher in consumer psychology, he has been named one of Poets & Quants' "World's Best 40 B-School Profs Under 40." His research focuses on how brands, prices, and choice architecture influence shopper decision-making, and his findings have been published in top academic journals and covered by major media outlets like The New York Times and CNN. His work highlights how psychology can help firms better understand and serve their customers. Ryan has a new book launch in June 2025 called "The Growth Dilemma: Managing Your Brand When Different Customers Want Different Things" Harvard Business Press. Follow Ryan on LinkedIn.

Ben Shaw is Group Head of Strategy at Smarts, a global PR and Creative agency. Ben also led strategy at BBH and worked client-side with fast-growth start-ups Wheely and Unmind. He's passionate about how brands can challenge culture convention and create ideas people want to spend time with, working on brands like Audi, Google and Burger King. Beyond advertising, Ben champions mental health awareness and rare disease research, drawing on both personal experience and professional curiosity.

Nostalgia isn't just "remembering the good old days." It's a bittersweet emotion—the strange mix of warmth, loss, pride, and longing that can make you feel good… even when the memory you're describing sounds objectively terrible.

In this episode, Colin and Ryan dig into why nostalgia is so powerful (and why it's everywhere right now). They explore the paradox: people don't just get nostalgic about the happy stuff—they also get nostalgic about the hard stuff, because it becomes part of identity ("I survived," "it made me," "we were close," "look how far we've come").

And for Customer Experience? Nostalgia isn't retro wallpaper. It's an emotional lever tied to belonging, meaning, and identity—exactly the things that shape customer decisions.

What you'll hear in this episode

• Why nostalgia is pleasant and painful at the same time

• Why people compete over who had it worse

• How nostalgia acts like an emotional "anchor" during uncertainty

• How brands "clone" nostalgia in advertising—and why it works when it's authentic

Quote of the episode

"Nostalgia isn't about reliving the pain—it's about reliving the meaning." — Colin Shaw

Resources Mentioned

Colin Shaw - https://www.linkedin.com/in/colinrjshaw/

Professor Ryan Hamilton - http://linkedin.com/in/ryan-hamilton-49b3321

About the Hosts:

Colin Shaw is a LinkedIn 'Top Voice' with a massive 286,000 followers and 87,000 subscribers to his 'Why Customers Buy' newsletter. Shaw is named one of the world's 'Top 150 Business Influencers' by LinkedIn. His company, Beyond Philosophy LLC, has been selected four times by the Financial Times as a top management consultancy. Shaw is co-host of the top 1.5% podcast 'The Intuitive Customer'—with over 600,000 downloads—and author of eight best-sellers on customer experience. Shaw is a sought-after keynote speaker. Follow Colin on LinkedIn.

Ryan Hamilton is a Professor of Marketing at Emory University's Goizueta Business School and co-author of 'The Intuitive Customer' book. An award-winning teacher and researcher in consumer psychology, he has been named one of Poets & Quants' "World's Best 40 B-School Profs Under 40." His research focuses on how brands, prices, and choice architecture influence shopper decision-making, and his findings have been published in top academic journals and covered by major media outlets like The New York Times and CNN. His work highlights how psychology can help firms better understand and serve their customers. Ryan has a new book launch in June 2025 called "The Growth Dilemma: Managing Your Brand When Different Customers Want Different Things" Harvard Business Press Follow Ryan on LinkedIn.

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Everyone's racing to be "AI-first." The problem? Customers didn't vote for it. In this episode, we unpack a practical decision framework for when AI should lead, when humans must lead, and how to avoid automating the very moments that drive loyalty (or churn). We also get into a surprising twist: why AI can sometimes sound more empathetic than people—and what that says about how most service teams are set up today.

What you'll learn in this episode

• Why "AI-first" is usually a cost initiative pretending to be a strategy

• A simple way to decide human vs AI based on the emotional and situational stakes

• Where automation genuinely improves CX (and where it quietly wrecks trust)

• Why AI can come across as more patient and empathetic—and why that's a warning sign

Best Quote from the Episode:

"AI-first' is not a strategy. It's a cost program wearing a strategy's suit." - Colin Shaw

Resources Mentioned

Colin Shaw - https://www.linkedin.com/in/colinrjshaw/

Professor Ryan Hamilton - http://linkedin.com/in/ryan-hamilton-49b3321

About the Hosts:

Colin Shaw is a LinkedIn 'Top Voice' with a massive 286,000 followers and 87,000 subscribers to his 'Why Customers Buy' newsletter. Shaw is named one of the world's 'Top 150 Business Influencers' by LinkedIn. His company, Beyond Philosophy LLC, has been selected four times by the Financial Times as a top management consultancy. Shaw is co-host of the top 1.5% podcast 'The Intuitive Customer'—with over 600,000 downloads—and author of eight best-sellers on customer experience. Shaw is a sought-after keynote speaker. Follow Colin on LinkedIn.

Ryan Hamilton is a Professor of Marketing at Emory University's Goizueta Business School and co-author of 'The Intuitive Customer' book. An award-winning teacher and researcher in consumer psychology, he has been named one of Poets & Quants' "World's Best 40 B-School Profs Under 40." His research focuses on how brands, prices, and choice architecture influence shopper decision-making, and his findings have been published in top academic journals and covered by major media outlets like The New York Times and CNN. His work highlights how psychology can help firms better understand and serve their customers. Ryan has a new book launch in June 2025 called "The Growth Dilemma: Managing Your Brand When Different Customers Want Different Things" Harvard Business Press Follow Ryan on LinkedIn.

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Customer Experience isn't short of activity—it's short of new ideas that actually land. In this episode, Colin and Ryan dig into why genuinely fresh thinking in CX struggles to break through, how industries get stuck in "normal science," and why it feels like we're doing more measurement… without more progress. They explore what a real disruption looks like, the warning signs that a paradigm is reaching diminishing returns, and how leaders can break out of the loop.

Best Quote

"When a paradigm hits its limits, the next move isn't 'do more.' It's think differently—and be willing to ruffle a few feathers." Colin Shaw:

Key Takeaways

• Are we measuring more because we're improving—or because we don't know what else to do?

• If satisfaction is stagnating, what "accepted" CX beliefs might be holding us back?

• What would a real CX disruption look like—and are we brave enough to recognize it when it shows up?

Why You Should Listen

If you've felt like CX is turning into an echo chamber—same language, same frameworks, same playbook—this episode gives you a sharper lens on why that happens and what to do next. You'll hear how paradigm shifts actually work, the signals that the current model is running out of runway, and practical ways to find (and foster) ideas that can genuinely move the industry forward.

Resources Mentioned

Colin Shaw - https://www.linkedin.com/in/colinrjshaw/

Professor Ryan Hamilton - http://linkedin.com/in/ryan-hamilton-49b3321

ACSI National Customer Satisfaction (Q3 2025 press release): https://theacsi.org/news-and-resources/press-releases/2025/11/13/press-release-national-acsi-q3-2025/

PwC Global Workforce Hopes and Fears (psychological safety): https://www.pwc.com/gx/en/issues/workforce/hopes-and-fears.html

About the Hosts:

Colin Shaw is a LinkedIn 'Top Voice' with a massive 286,000 followers and 87,000 subscribers to his 'Why Customers Buy' newsletter. Shaw is named one of the world's 'Top 150 Business Influencers' by LinkedIn. His company, Beyond Philosophy LLC, has been selected four times by the Financial Times as a top management consultancy. Shaw is co-host of the top 1.5% podcast 'The Intuitive Customer'—with over 600,000 downloads—and author of eight best-sellers on customer experience. Shaw is a sought-after keynote speaker. Follow Colin on LinkedIn.

Ryan Hamilton is a Professor of Marketing at Emory University's Goizueta Business School and co-author of 'The Intuitive Customer' book. An award-winning teacher and researcher in consumer psychology, he has been named one of Poets & Quants' "World's Best 40 B-School Profs Under 40." His research focuses on how brands, prices, and choice architecture influence shopper decision-making, and his findings have been published in top academic journals and covered by major media outlets like The New York Times and CNN. His work highlights how psychology can help firms better understand and serve their customers. Ryan has a new book launch in June 2025 called "The Growth Dilemma: Managing Your Brand When Different Customers Want Different Things" Harvard Business Press Follow Ryan on LinkedIn.

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In this episode, Ryan Hamilton and I dig into the invisible "scripts" that hold everyday customer experiences together—those unwritten psychological expectations about what happens next, what signals mean, and how both customers and employees coordinate without even thinking about it. The trouble is: when technology (like mobile payments, kiosks, or automation) changes the steps, it can quietly break the script—creating uncertainty, awkwardness, and friction that wasn't there before. We explore why these scripts matter, how they differ by culture, and what leaders can do to help customers adopt new scripts without creating "prairie dog" moments.

Best Quote from the Episode

"A lot of customer experiences work because both sides know the script—until something changes and nobody knows what to do next." Professor Ryan Hamilton

Key Takeaways

• What "scripts" are you unknowingly relying on in your customer journey—and what happens when they break?

• If you introduce new tech, what clear "signal" replaces the old customer behavior that used to communicate intent?

• How are you designing for different adoption speeds—early adopters and customers who want the old way back?

Why You Should Listen

If you're rolling out AI, automation, self-service, kiosks, or new payment methods, this episode will help you spot the hidden expectations that make experiences feel effortless—and show you how to redesign the cues and signals so customers don't feel confused, awkward, or abandoned.

Resources Mentioned

Colin Shaw - https://www.linkedin.com/in/colinrjshaw/

Professor Ryan Hamilton - http://linkedin.com/in/ryan-hamilton-49b3321

Monty Python "haggling" clip (Life of Brian): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2iZjxSGca8

Our Workshops: https://beyondphilosophy.com/motivational-workshops/

About the Hosts:

Colin Shaw is a LinkedIn 'Top Voice' with a massive 286,000 followers and 87,000 subscribers to his 'Why Customers Buy' newsletter. Shaw is named one of the world's 'Top 150 Business Influencers' by LinkedIn. His company, Beyond Philosophy LLC, has been selected four times by the Financial Times as a top management consultancy. Shaw is co-host of the top 1.5% podcast 'The Intuitive Customer'—with over 600,000 downloads—and author of eight best-sellers on customer experience. Shaw is a sought-after keynote speaker. Follow Colin on LinkedIn.

Ryan Hamilton is a Professor of Marketing at Emory University's Goizueta Business School and co-author of 'The Intuitive Customer' book. An award-winning teacher and researcher in consumer psychology, he has been named one of Poets & Quants' "World's Best 40 B-School Profs Under 40." His research focuses on how brands, prices, and choice architecture influence shopper decision-making, and his findings have been published in top academic journals and covered by major media outlets like The New York Times and CNN. His work highlights how psychology can help firms better understand and serve their customers. Ryan has a new book launch in June 2025 called "The Growth Dilemma: Managing Your Brand When Different Customers Want Different Things" Harvard Business Press Follow Ryan on LinkedIn.

Subscribe & Follow

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Why do we actively seek out content that makes us angry? In this episode, Colin Shaw and Professor Ryan Hamilton explore the idea of consuming anger as an emotional experience. From doomscrolling and rage-bait headlines to viral customer complaints and outrage-driven media, they unpack why anger is such a powerful, bonding, and profitable emotion — and what this means for Customer Experience.

"Sometimes people don't just experience anger — they actively consume it, because it makes them feel alive."

Professor Ryan Hamilton

• Anger is not just a reaction — it's often a deliberate emotional choice

• People consume negative emotions (anger, fear, disgust, sadness) because emotion beats boredom

• Rage-bait content works because it delivers safe emotional arousal with no personal risk

• Brands can unintentionally create rage bait, losing control of the narrative

• There may be no emotion that can't be monetized — but that raises ethical questions

Resources Mentioned

Overton's window - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMU0w4MP8Dc&t=5s

Colin Shaw - https://www.linkedin.com/in/colinrjshaw/

Professor Ryan Hamilton - http://linkedin.com/in/ryan-hamilton-49b3321

About the Hosts:

Colin Shaw is a LinkedIn 'Top Voice' with a massive 286,000 followers and 87,000 subscribers to his 'Why Customers Buy' newsletter. Shaw is named one of the world's 'Top 150 Business Influencers' by LinkedIn. His company, Beyond Philosophy LLC, has been selected four times by the Financial Times as a top management consultancy. Shaw is co-host of the top 1.5% podcast 'The Intuitive Customer'—with over 600,000 downloads—and author of eight best-sellers on customer experience. Shaw is a sought-after keynote speaker. Follow Colin on LinkedIn.

Ryan Hamilton is a Professor of Marketing at Emory University's Goizueta Business School and co-author of 'The Intuitive Customer' book. An award-winning teacher and researcher in consumer psychology, he has been named one of Poets & Quants' "World's Best 40 B-School Profs Under 40." His research focuses on how brands, prices, and choice architecture influence shopper decision-making, and his findings have been published in top academic journals and covered by major media outlets like The New York Times and CNN. His work highlights how psychology can help firms better understand and serve their customers. Ryan has a new book launch in June 2025 called "The Growth Dilemma: Managing Your Brand When Different Customers Want Different Things" Harvard Business Press Follow Ryan on LinkedIn.

Subscribe & Follow

Apple Podcasts

Spotify