In this episode of TAP, Tim Ahlman is joined by pastor, author, and theologian Carl Lehenbauer for a wide-ranging and deeply human conversation about ministry longevity, marriage, discipleship, and the fire of God’s love that holds it all together.

Carl shares his journey from associate pastor to senior pastor—and now into a discipleship-focused role—reflecting honestly on burnout, self-awareness, delegation, and the quiet faithfulness that sustains long-term ministry. From there, the conversation moves into the heart of Carl’s new book, Fire and Song, a rich exploration of the Song of Songs as God’s love song to His people.

Together, Tim and Carl explore:

- Why love—not programs—is the foundation of a healthy church
- How God’s love fuels marriage rather than asking couples to manufacture it
- The connection between the Song of Songs, Pentecost, and the Holy Spirit
- Why admiration and commitment still matter in a distracted culture
- How marriage forms us into people who look more like Christ

This episode is honest, theological, pastoral, and hopeful—a reminder that God’s love is not only proclaimed, but sung over His people.

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