Angelica Cortez learned how to get a bunch of people in a room with different opinions to come together and produce good work. Her leadership lessons didn't first come from a seminar, book, or podcast, but from watching her grandfather. He was a strict, no-nonsense man who tested his grandkids on bones and motherboards, but he turned soft and unguarded the moment he picked up a guitar.

Researchers Guy Itzchakov and Avraham Kluger found the same thing in their work on listening: how a person is received in a conversation changes whether they keep talking and how much of themselves they're willing to share. Cortez turned that strategy into a process for her board to create a new strategic plan, when no one walked in with the same ideas or values. It's proof that you don't need to win the argument to align your team.

This episode is for anyone leading a room that's giving you less than you know they have. You'll leave with a clearer sense of what actually makes people show up fully, how to ask questions with clarity without needing to correct anyone, and what it looks like to become the kind of trusted leader people stop editing themselves for.

LINKS:

Guest

• Angelica Cortez, Executive Director, Suzuki Association of the Americas: https://suzukiassociation.org/journalarticle/meet-executive-director-angelica-cortez/

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/angelica-ivonne-cortez/

Suzuki Association of the Americas

• https://suzukiassociation.org/

Connect with Margaret

• https://thespeakershiplab.com/

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/margaretwattsromney/

  
  

Research

• Kluger, A. N., & Itzchakov, G. (2022). The Power of Listening at Work. Annual Review of Organizational Psychology and Organizational Behavior, 9, 121–146.
  https://www.annualreviews.org/content/journals/10.1146/annurev-orgpsych-012420-091013

Music acknowledgments

• Circle of fifths / scale practice — https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3GiWauofIA

You already know how to push yourself. You've earned the wins nobody saw, the early mornings, the extra hours, and the miles all alone.

But now you're the one leading people, and a harder question shows up. When do you let someone struggle their way to their own belief about themself, and when do you hand them the positive reflection they need to hear from you?

This episode follows former Olympic Gold Medal swimming coach and current executive leader coach Steve Mellor through both sides of that question, in his own life first.

Steve built his self-belief alone, five a.m. after five a.m., before he ever coached a single swimmer. Then he had to stand across from swimmers who looked at him and said, "I can't do this without you," and tell them the truth: they could.

Steve built a respected career across collegiate and international swimming before he ever coached a single executive. He made the leap anyway, one guest conversation at a time, until the podcast he started as a side project became the thing that told him who he was becoming next.

You'll hear the real research behind why some belief has to be built alone to count, and why some belief only becomes real once someone else hands it to you, and which one should come first.



Note: There is another British swimmer named Steven Mellor who competed at the 1992 Barcelona Olympics. Our guest is a different person."

Note on Olympic gold medal: Steve Mellor coached Brooks Curry, who swam in a qualifying heat at the Tokyo Olympics in place of Caeleb Dressel, specifically so Dressel could rest for the final. The US Men's team then won gold in the relay, with Dressel leading off. Right after the medal ceremony, Dressel walked off the podium, found Curry in the stands, called him down to the first row, and tossed him his gold medal, saying, ‘I felt like he deserved that a little more than me.’

Steve Mellor Growth Ready coaching: https://growthready.com/

Steve Mellor Growth Ready podcast: https://growthready.com/podcasts/

Brain activation from positive self descriptions
https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/human-neuroscience/articles/10.3389/fnhum.2021.700046/full

Social rewards same place as money: "The findings suggest that social and monetary rewards are processed by the same population of neurons within these regions of the striatum. "
https://academic.oup.com/scan/article/12/10/1558/3980284?login=false

Bandura on Self-efficacy:
https://www.google.com/books/edition/Self_Efficacy/eJ-PN9g_o-EC?hl=en&gbpv=1

Have you ever been in a conversation that suddenly went somewhere you didn't expect, and felt yourself go completely blank?

Most of us have been told that the answer to high-pressure communication is more confidence: more talking points, more volume, more assuredness. So when a conversation goes sideways, and none of that seems to work, it feels like the floor has dropped out.

But what if there's a structure underneath every moment of change? A pattern you already know? What if the skill of speaking through pivots and surprises isn't about having more answers, but about knowing what questions to ask to see the bigger picture? To see the bigger story you're in.

BY THE TIME YOU FINISH LISTENING, YOU'LL DISCOVER:

• Why story is the simplest and most powerful map for navigating moments of change

• The three elements of every story, NOW, UNKNOWN, NEW, and how naming which one is shaky can help you find your footing again

• What WALL-E and a cat covered in red sauce teach us about our brains and what goes wrong when two people are living in different stories at once

The next time something goes sideways in a conversation, you don't have to reach for more content. You just need to ask who and where you are in the story.

Follow me on Instagram so you can see behind the scenes of how I help leaders communicate with clarity, confidence, and connection and how you can too.

LEARN MORE FROM MARGARET: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/margaretwattsromney/ Instagram: @thespeakershiplab

OTHER LINKS MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:

AmeriQuest "Don't Judge Too Quickly" ad

Episode 1: What Is Speakership?