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In this episode, Dr. Gabrielle Lyon sits down with Dr. Donald Layman, one of the world’s leading protein researchers and a key contributor to the newly released U.S. Dietary Guidelines. They explore why the old food pyramid failed, how nutrition science became driven by ideology instead of evidence, and what the updated guidelines finally get right about protein, fats, and carbohydrates. Dr. Layman explains why the long-standing protein recommendation of 0.8 g/kg was never intended for optimal health and how higher protein intake supports body composition, metabolic health, and nutrient adequacy.

The conversation also dives into controversial topics including saturated fat, carbohydrate tolerance, animal versus plant protein, and the limitations of epidemiology in nutrition research. Gabrielle and Dr. Layman discuss how dietary guidelines shape school lunches, hospitals, and public institutions, and why a protein-first framework empowers individuals to make better nutrition decisions, especially as we age. This episode offers a clear, science-backed roadmap for understanding modern nutrition — cutting through misinformation and outdated dogma to focus on strength, longevity, and real-world application.

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Chapters:

00:00 Why Dietary Guidelines Exist and Why This Moment Matters

01:20 The Hidden Origins of the Food Pyramid (World War II + Public Health)

02:55 The Original Protein RDA: A Basement Number, Not Optimal Health

05:50 Why the Old Guidelines Focused on What Not to Eat

07:25 Why Protein Was Avoided for Decades

08:50 Nitrogen Balance: Why It Never Predicted Health Outcomes

11:10 Epidemiology vs Controlled Trials in Nutrition Science

13:05 How the Protein Evidence Was Evaluated for the New Guidelines

14:15 Why Higher Protein Improves Weight, Fat Loss, and Lean Mass

15:35 Is “Too Much Protein” Actually Dangerous?

16:40 Nutrient Deficiencies Risk on Low-Protein Diets

17:35 Animal vs Plant Protein: Bioavailability and Amino Acids

18:45 Why 0.8 g/kg Was Never Better Than Higher Protein

20:15 Empowering Consumers Instead of One-Size-Fits-All Nutrition

21:10 How Guidelines Shape School Lunches, Hospitals, and the Military

23:05 Protein-First Meal Planning Explained

24:50 Why the First Meal Matters More as You Age

27:15 Does Protein Distribution Matter After 50?

30:00 Protein, Satiety, and Appetite Control

31:05 Why “Ounce Equivalents” Between Plant and Animal Protein Don’t Work

34:05 The Saturated Fat Myth and Why the 10% Rule Persists

38:30 Where Saturated Fat Really Comes From in the Modern Diet

39:45 Updated Fruit, Vegetable, and Grain