In this episode of the Made For More podcast, host Ally Nitschke, is joined by burnout expert and author Sally Clarke. Sally shares her remarkable journey, from her upbringing in South Australia to working as a corporate finance lawyer in Europe, and ultimately transitioning to a more meaningful life in Morocco.

The conversation dives deep into the topic of burnout, which Sally experienced firsthand during her time in a high-pressure law firm. She reflects on the pivotal moment she recognised the signs of burnout and the transformative steps she took to recover, including a life-changing move to Morocco and a reconnection with nature.

Sally offers a powerful reframe of burnout, describing it not as a personal weakness but as a natural response to chronic stress influenced by societal, organisational, and internalised cultural pressures. She highlights the importance of self-knowledge, self-awareness, and self-compassion in both preventing and recovering from burnout.

Throughout the episode, Sally and Ally explore generational shifts in attitudes towards work and wellbeing. Sally provides valuable insights for leaders seeking to build supportive and engaging workplace cultures, along with practical strategies to recognise and address burnout, both personally and within teams.

Listeners can connect with Sally via LinkedIn or through her website at www.salcla.com. For those who may be experiencing burnout, she encourages reaching out for support and taking proactive steps towards healing and balance.

This episode offers an inspiring and thought-provoking look at how individuals and organisations can better understand, prevent, and respond to burnout in today’s world of work.

00:03:26 - Corporate law career shift.

00:05:36 - Workplace burnout awareness and stigma.

00:09:21 - Burnout causes and prevention.

00:10:23 - Organizational culture and burnout.

00:14:01 - Work contributing to society.

00:19:09 - Burnout among high performers.

00:20:45 - The three selves framework.

00:25:06 - Symptoms of burnout.

00:28:00 - Burnout and self-awareness strategies.

00:30:56 - Leadership and wellbeing strategies.

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Connect with Sally Clarke

www.salcla.com

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In this insightful episode of the Made For More podcast, Ally Nitschke is joined by the dynamic and creative Joel McKerrow, a renowned Australian poet, speaker, and creative facilitator. Known fondly as the “red-headed poet guy,” Joel brings a unique blend of creativity, depth, and storytelling expertise to the conversation.

Joel shares his remarkable journey from working in youth and social work to becoming a celebrated spoken word poet and keynote speaker. He opens the episode with a compelling poetic introduction that immediately sets the tone for a rich, thought-provoking dialogue.

Throughout the conversation, Joel explores the transformative power of storytelling in leadership, asserting that all human behaviour is shaped by the stories we tell ourselves and those around us. He underscores the critical importance of listening as a foundational skill for effective leadership.

Joel and Ally also delve into the role of creativity in leadership, with Joel cautioning against an over-dependence on artificial intelligence for creative tasks. He champions the value of facing the blank page, embracing the discomfort of self-confrontation, and finding authentic expression through creativity.

Offering practical takeaways, Joel encourages leaders to engage in inner work, excavate their personal stories, and empower others to reframe and articulate their own. His passion for storytelling as a tool for connection, engagement, and transformation is evident throughout the discussion.

Listeners interested in Joel’s work can connect with him via LinkedIn, Instagram, or explore further resources on joelmckerrow.com.

A heartfelt thank you to Joel McKerrow for sharing his wisdom, poetic brilliance, and deep insight into how creativity and storytelling can elevate leadership and drive meaningful change.

00:00:00 - Introduction to Joel McKerrow

00:00:40 - Joel's Unique Approach to Poetry

00:01:01 - The Invitation of the Present Moment

00:02:31 - Host's Reaction to Joel's Poetry

00:03:01 - Joel's Background and Journey

00:04:04 - Transition from Social Work to Poetry

00:05:09 - Impact of Poetry on Transformation

00:06:03 - Combining Poetry with Leadership

00:07:03 - The Power of Story in Leadership

00:08:07 - Stories Shaping Human Behavior

00:09:10 - Organizational Stories and Culture

00:10:03 - Applied Narrative Intelligence

00:11:05 - Internal Stories and Self-Growth

00:12:03 - Importance of Listening

00:13:07 - Listening to Deeper Stories

00:14:10 - Plot vs. Story in Human Experience

00:15:02 - Internal Listening and Self-Reflection

00:16:05 - Quality of Presence in Relationships

00:17:12 - Practical Tips for Better Listening

00:18:15 - Intentional Presence and Deep Listening

00:19:09 - Joel's Practice of Writing Weekly Poems

00:20:25 - The Impact of Personalized Poems

00:21:07 - Listening for Meta and Metaphor

00:22:00 - Using Metaphor to Convey Depth

00:23:06 - Metaphor in Organizational Vision

00:24:04 - Shared Experience through Metaphor

00:25:06 - Storytelling for Team Engagement

00:26:00 - Visionary Leadership and Storytelling

00:27:00 - Real-Life Stories in Vision Casting

00:28:03 - Example of Sean Askinosie's Story

00:29:01 - Transformational Power of Dark Stories

00:30:03 - Joseph Campbell's Cave Metaphor

00:31:07 - Authenticity in Leadership Stories

00:32:04 - AI and Creativity in Leadership

00:33:04 - The Risk of Over-Reliance on AI

00:34:07 - Facing the Blank Page and Fear

00:35:01 - The Importance of Creative Muscles

00:36:04 - Authentic Human Stories for Impact

00:37:09 - Unique...

Show Notes

Welcome to the Made For More podcast. In this episode, Ally Nitschke shares a recap of her action-packed May, which included extensive travel and client engagements. She also announces some exciting news: her team has been named finalists in five categories for the prestigious ROAR Awards, celebrating excellence in small business across Australia. This recognition reflects the unwavering dedication of both her team and her incredible clients.

The core theme of this episode is “the art of being uncomfortable” and why discomfort is essential for leadership growth. Drawing on her unique background, including her early years as a professional ballet dancer, Ally explores how embracing discomfort can fuel both personal and professional development. She reframes discomfort not as a red flag, but as evidence of trying something new, courageous, and transformative.

Listeners will walk away with practical tools for reframing discomfort as a catalyst for growth. Ally offers advice on starting small, consistently stretching beyond what feels familiar, and building a network of support to help navigate uncomfortable moments.

She also shares a personal story from her ballet career, one that required deep courage and mental fortitude to perform a physically demanding jump... Highlighting the power of mindset in overcoming challenges.

To close, Ally invites listeners to reflect on one area in their life where they can lean into discomfort and take a bold step forward. Because, as she reminds us, real growth happens at the edge of our comfort zone.

Tune in and be inspired to take your next bold leap.

Timestamps

[00:01:05] Five categories finalist excitement.

[00:04:28] The art of being uncomfortable.

[00:09:37] Failure as feedback.

[00:12:40] Growth through discomfort.

[00:15:34] Embracing discomfort in leadership.

[00:19:40] Leaning into discomfort for growth.

Links

Breakfast Roadshow - www.madeformore.com.au/events

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