This week, Nadia hosts solo while Rob is away, revisiting a powerful interview she and Rob recorded with Paolo Gaudiano. The conversation explores why equity and meritocracy are not opposites, but incomplete views of the same system and how leaders can move beyond ideology to design fair, high-performing organizations. Stick around as Nadia also shares a personal surprise at the end of the episode.

Find season 5 episode transcripts here: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1bP3N6QYBG0UkzdRm5GwiFfoQLvGtIRrK?usp=sharing

Connect with Paolo:

https://aleria.tech

https://linkedin.com/in/pgaudiano

Measuring Inclusion: https://amazon.com/dp/178860606X

Meritocracy (due out 6/9/26): https://www.amazon.com/dp/1788609433

Paolo's TED speaker page: https://ted.com/speakers/paolo_gaudiano

Connect with us: Visit www.nazconsultants.com to learn more about Dr. Nadia Butt’s work in leadership, culture, and organizational effectiveness, and check out http://www.tekanoconsulting.com/ to explore Rob Hadley’s approach to data-driven inclusive strategy.

Send us your thoughts or topic ideas at inclusivecollectivepodcast@gmail.com

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Connect with Nadia: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nadianazbutt/

Connect with Rob: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rob-hadley-utah/