Dal Sanders has interviewed the Sex Pistols and the Allman Brothers, built a viral television segment, landed an internationally syndicated TV show, and somehow ended up teaching kids communication skills through magic. His career doesn't follow a straight line -- and that's exactly what makes this conversation worth an hour.

Dal is the founder of Amazing Attractions and the Texas Magic Academy, a past president of the Society of American Magicians, and the current president of FISM North America -- the international federation that represents magicians worldwide. He came to all of it through rock and roll radio, which turned out to be better marketing training than most business schools offer.

In this episode, Dal walks Derrel and Kris through the full arc -- from spinning records and getting backstage access to legendary acts, to incorporating magic into live promotional events, to building the Texas Magic Academy around the idea that illusion is really just applied communication. He's candid about what didn't work, including high-cost ad campaigns that produced nothing, and what did, including creative risks that generated media coverage money can't buy.

The pandemic chapter is worth noting too. Dal pivoted when most entertainment businesses folded. That ability to read the room and move fast is a throughline in everything he's built.

Derrel knows this world firsthand -- he's a professional magician himself -- which gives this conversation a depth you don't get from a standard host-guest format. Two people who've both made a living doing the impossible, talking about how to build a business around it.

Derrel Allen -- Total Online Marketing
www.totalmagic.com

Kris O'Connor -- Kris O'Connor Marketing Gems
bttom.com/url/kris

Dal Sanders
stagemagic.com

Amazing Attractions
amazingattractions.com

Texas Magic Academy
bttom.com/url/tma
214-720-2262

Follow the show: bttom.com/url/pod

The opinions expressed by guests on TOM Talks Online Marketing are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of the hosts or Total Online Marketing LLC.